when really, a few skills to beat whatever "trick" is being played by other players or the Bot/Boss AI is all that is required. It is not rocket science to know that LoD counters party-wide degen better than WoH, or that an interrupted spell or attack is better than a heal.
Page 13!
Quote:
Anyone know kids playing the game? They have problems completing specific missions or bosses, like say Cyndr, until you help them choose the right set of "skills", then it is all gravy.
I'm telling you, that lrn2play is really lrn2capskills.
All that these players who are having difficulty in the game need to do is cap the right skills to counter builds.
Quote:
Without blind, or those run "skills", or some other "skill" based trick to counter the cheeze that is the bosses, then those bosses are nearly impossible to beat, regardless of your skill level. You could be the best GW player on the plater, and Magni will beat you every day, and twice on Sunday, without a gimmick to beat his gimmick. Welcome to Guild Wars, and get to capping all those needed "skills". Otherwise, you'll find that your game experience is awfully........ frustrating? Like the OP, for instance.
No, the logic is not escaping you, because you did not read anything I wrote. 
Thanks!
TabascoSauce
25 Sep 2007 at 00:01 - 371
"No man's knowledge can exceed his experience". (I saw that somewhere in this forum) So if you don't have the experience in "high end" PVP/PVE, you don't have the knowledge to speak on behalf of others who do.
25 Sep 2007 at 00:29 - 372
This is just another example. 2 Monks with the same skill bar. A bad monk will get swallowed under pressure and cry for energy half way. A good monk will know exactly how to react to maximize his heals without running into energy trouble. I've experienced this first-hand on many many occasions. A bad monk will need a Necro to babysit his energy. (you'll find them doing DoA  ) A good Monk will tell the Necro to stop saccing for no reason.
Thousand of people use cookie cutter builds they get from friends/online. These builds have been tried, tested and proven to work and yet thousands of people fail daily and thousands of others succeed. This is with the exact same skill bars. So what's the difference with the people who fail and the people who succeed?
Having a working skill bar is 1 thing. Knowing how and when to use it is another and NO it's not always obvious.
25 Sep 2007 at 01:58 - 373
Quote:
Originally Posted by byteme!
The original topic is no longer covered and it's just a bunch of people rambling back and forth.
Raise a pint to that!!
The last couple of pages here are really way out of the context of what was originally being discussed. Let's try to end it here and get back to the topic at hand. Suffice it to say, that the PvP vs. PvE discussion can never be resolved, as we clearly see here. Everyone on both sides of the fence have valid points and are right - they are also just as wrong on many other points. But in the end it is simply a circular argument - PvPers will never convince the PvEers of their points and vice versa.
Getting back to the real discussion here. There are several problems with the basic game (normal mode for the casual player), as is. These are the ones I have heard most commonly voiced over the last three years:
(Keep in mind we are talking about the base game, not any PvP or clearly labeled Elite/High End content, including HM)
1) The game is too easy
2) *Insert quest/mission/area name here* is too hard
3) The drops suck
4) When the h*ll is Anet going to do anything about this bot problem
Thus far, what has Anet done to alleviate these complaints?
1) Established High End and Elite content, and have created Hard Mode
2) A) Given us an open system allowing infinite character adjustments except for the chosen primary profession.
B) Made AI changes several times both to enemies and to the henchman
C) Given us the Hero mechanic
3) Locked Chests and better rewards for the High End content.
4) Researches complaints and closes bot accounts on a daily basis
At this point in time, with the final content addition to the original GW, where do we now stand on these issues?
1) Normal Mode in all but *some* non-elite areas of EotN is even easier thanks to the Hero system, and combat has become more of a nuisance than a challenge, and rarely even requires player input when soloing or traveling with one other Human companion.
2) Unless you spend a lot of time practicing new builds, you will still not be successful in a lot of non-elite areas, and these areas have become very frustrating to the normal and casual player of GW
3) Unless it's a Chest or a Unique, the drops still suck.
4) The bots just keep coming
Now, many pages back I described the basics of a new combat system that I think would address all these problems. Some people have disagreed, and others have agreed that changes are needed. But I believe that if done correctly, my combat system will do the following:
1) Bring back the challenge and fun to combat by forcing the player to actively participate in order to succeed - no more aggro-afk-ftw battles
2) Make individual build choices irrelevant except for how they will work with the team. This makes choosing the right skills, teamwork, and forming a diverse and competent team build the most important factor in PvE, while still allowing players play the game they way they want to in all areas except for HM and the Elite zones.
3) Make the drop rewards based upon the Team's build, types of attacks, and efficiency in tactics and teamwork, and rewarding players who take the greater risks with the greater rewards.
4) Make soloing combat impossible, thereby eliminating the means of the solo bot farmer. For legitimate solo farmers, simply by forming a Hero/Hench party and creating a high level of risk/reward attack chains to use in combat, they will end up receiving equivalent or better rewards than they could get now.
Hanok Odbrook
Real Millennium Group Guild
Truth * Knowledge * Peace
25 Sep 2007 at 03:09 - 374
Quote:
Originally Posted by TabascoSauce
Okay Sab. You're obviously laboring under the delusion that you are somehow superior to everyone else here, let me knock you down a few clouds, say to reality - earth.
If you have, as a fixed firm belief, the idea that PvP is the only place to learn team coordination and cooperation, then you realize that there is a long history of people repeatedly implying that their own specific particular competitive event is beyond the reach of the common joe and that they as rarefied experts have some innately superior brain to comprehend the intricacies of (insert competitive sport here)? You know that you are just another........ weenie?
If it was all that, you'd be paid a salary. Oh, you don't? Yeah. Glad we got that straight. Otherwise, some reader of this thread might get confused and think you were an actual subject expert with some sort of independent qualification or three. Oh, you dont? Uh huh.
You need to spend time in the military, which you obviously have not. That is coordination and cooperation. GW PvP is 8 guys on some kind of VoIP pretending that they are athletes and that they are actually accomplishing something. Um, someone counting down for everyone relatively simultaneously pressing the "3" key to spike a target is not that hard, whatever you personally may say. You are sitting here sounding like a whiny weenie, all crying about how complicated GW PvP is and implying that only you (and some rare few) can comprehend the nuances, and thereby analyze and draw conclusions about anything related to PvP. Yeah, counting down and pressing the three key requires years of training? Uh huh.
Geez, go talk to the Counter-Strike or Unreal weenies, and compare how complex the "games" are. They say the same things you do, and some of them actually get paid to play their game. Oh yeah, thats right, we covered that two paragraphs ago - you don't get paid. No sponsored full time teams. Yeah, you try and convince me that your game is more involved or more complex. (snicker) Let alone to a real sport like football where there are millions on the line at every game.
Reality check #1 - this thread is not even about PvP, but you are so ego-driven about it that you want to hijack the thread and make it into a referendum on other posters, specifically me, because you have no argument other than patently wrong blanket statements that GW PvP is your area of expertise and others cannot comment on it. Yeah, Ele and B-surge. You have different terminology now, but the song remains the same. "Spike my target on 3". That's PhD material, there.
Reality check #2 - How is it that sportscasters can accurately analyze sports, without actually ever having played them?
Do you think an outside observer, when watching controversy in Golf, can make an accurate analysis when the equipment used allows amateurs with high-tech titanium drivers to out-drive, and thereby get lower scores, than the semi-pro players with regular woods?
What about the average beer-swilling football fan. It is football season right now, I am sure you know a few. Are you ready to claim that they are unable to accurately comment on the games they watch because they have never played themselves? Particularly since they can generally quote you statistics, and know the inner workings of the game (and the exact numbers on equippable skills if football had them, like GW)?
I'm sorry bro, if you think GW PvP is more complicated or competitive than professional football, then this conversation can end right here, and you should go watch football. Millions of dollars bro. That's serious stuff. You? Not so much.
Reality check # umpteen million - maybe you take this too seriously. I mean really, what do you care what I say? I'm not actually hitting you in a sensitive spot or anything saying the truth? (cause you certainly act that way) Heck, find me IRL, and if you are old enough I'll buy you the beer of your choice. This is a forum and people disagree. Now, if that is a shocker for you, then watch out, because people also occasionally agree.
Pot, meet kettle.
I am not the one claiming that anything I do is beyond the reach of the common man. Yeah, consider this reality check #4. You can come down from the clouds now.
So, do you want to talk about the subject of the thread, or try and drag this into your own personal axe to grind, convincing other people that your hobby, not paid job, is so complex that others cannot understand without dedicating a portion (a few months heh) of their life to it themselves as much as you have?
Do you really expect anyone to believe that, and not see it as the Ego-Superiority trip that it is?
Believe me, within a few months, people get competitive at any PvP game, including GW. That is not the picture you are painting, but oh well, why pop your bubble, right?
Seriously, I'm telling you, "learn to play" really means "learn to cap skills".
Wanna talk about that? I think that is closer to the topic at hand, moreso than your own ego-rant about how tough GW PvP is to masta, like a playa.
I normally say "Thanks!", but not this time. As long as you have the "I can masta what the common man cannot" attitude, I'll leave you with this:
Seek professional help if GW PvP is that important to you.
TabascoSauce
Oh my lord. You are so unbelievably wrong it makes my head hurt. Stop writing about PvP, because you CLEARLY have zero experience in it. All of your comparisons and analogies are wrong, your assumptions are wrong, and you are wrong.
I was going to highlight certain parts of your abortion of a post, but there's just too much garbage there for me to be bothered reading again. Sab is better than you at PvP, and better than you at PvE. He is right, you are wrong.
For everyone reading this, ignore TabascoSauce, he will guide you in the wrong direction. Sab's very valid point is such; if you have played in high level GvG, then you will have a MUCH better understanding of strategy/communication, and therefore will be much more capable of beating PvE. TabascoSauce has never BEEN in high level GvG, so his comments are based on assumptions, and of posts he has read discussing GvG. I imagine those posts were probably made in a PvE guilds forum.
This topic WAS valuable for players, but a few clueless idiots have made it pointless. If you feel the need to post uneducated garbage, please do it elsewhere. Like on GWO. It's great for this crap.
25 Sep 2007 at 04:24 - 375
You know, guild wars is actually a pretty easy game...Interrupting 3/4 spells on a regular basis and beating monsters that are dumb as a stick is nothing compared to top-clan halo matches with the ability to consistently score a 4-headshot killtacular with the sniper rifle. Or starcraft...and dont even get me started on counter strike. You guys think Im a PvP elitist ? Guess what my CS clan members said when I told them that their are people on these forums QQing about guild wars pve being too hard ? failure overload.
face it. MMO's are almost always the easiest genre of video games out their, and GW pve is no exception. Hate to join the crowd here but Im gonna give you the basic response:
QQ moar.
GB2 /Minesweeper
25 Sep 2007 at 05:17 - 376
Quote:
Originally Posted by fenix
if you have played in high level GvG, then you will have a MUCH better understanding of strategy/communication, and therefore will be much more capable of beating PvE
That is absolutely true. However, would you be able to tell the difference between "this player has superior strategic and tactical skills because he has been playing high level GvG" and "this player has been playing high level GvG because he has superior strategic and tactical skills"?
The difficulty of the standard PvE campaigns has been set really low - if you can show a modicum of intelligence then failure is not an option. This is, of course, completely unlike the PvP side where you cannot expect to win every match.
25 Sep 2007 at 06:25 - 377
This thread was about someone having a hard time with the game and it has turned a bit into a place for PvP'ers to flaunt their self-assumed superiority.
Aside from any arguments or the lack thereof I find this condescending attitude below anything. If your PvP ego's need to be fed so much perhaps you should realise it is because they are over-inflated.
There is nothing constructive or useful about plain arrogance. Please take it elsewhere.
The game is hard to play if you are not aware of certain game mechanics and AI reactions. So the message generally is that people need to familiarise themselves with those.
The absurd notion that PvP ers are better than PvE ers in general, aside from being beside the point , should not have such avid defenders. It is basically a gamers version of racism.
If you think this is an advertisement for people to start PvP as we must now be convinced of it's superiority....think again, this attitude accomplishes the opposite.
I don't know why people insist on having to feel superior over others, but if you need to go as far as to delve into prejudice and racism-like behaviour then perhaps you need to work on your self-confidence in real life a bit and get over that...it is a foul attitude.
25 Sep 2007 at 07:12 - 378
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avarre
bungusmaximus : Target calling is not an issue of what do you target first. It's a tactic of constantly rotating targets to capitalize on weak points in the enemy defense. As PvE monsters do not adapt to your build or offensive pattern, exploitation of opened weakpoints is nonexistent - you smash what they have and that's it.
True they don't adapt, but I most definitely don't 'smash what they have'. I won't smash stuff that's out of healing range for example, or stuff that takes ages to kill. I'd rather smash that margonite executioner that's sitting on my monk.
You can also exploit weak spots in PvE, such as a monster using frenzy all of a sudden. Whack him once or twice and he's dead twice as fast as the other monster, so guess what i will smash in such a situation.
Of course it's waaay more straight forward then an average GvG match. But it IS tue that you can put as much depth in it as you prefer. When I find myself PvP-ing I have the feeling that I play an entirely different game.
And then there's the fun thing that many PvP-ers don't switch targets and exploit weaknesses, they also 'smash what they have'. Like some stupid sin that´s wailing on a monk with 999 prot enchants on him :P. I can safely assume that peope like that aren't on your GvG team, but they do exist in pretty vast numbers.
I think only 25% of the GW community is actually good at the game, wether it's PvP or PvE doesn't matter.
25 Sep 2007 at 09:28 - 379
Quote:
Originally Posted by cthulhu reborn
This thread was about someone having a hard time with the game and it has turned a bit into a place for PvP'ers to flaunt their self-assumed superiority.
|
I have, combined, well over 20 million experience on various chars, mainly on a Mesmer. I have PKM on that mes, as well as several other titles at various stages, including grind titles like Treasure Hunter (6). I have written PvE articles on game theory, designed farming builds years ago with SMS, cleared FoW with 3 men back in 2005. I have full fissure earned solo/duo farming UW, and multiple tormented items.
What exactly is your point of calling me a 'PvPer'? I've done more PvE than PvP. Sab's story isn't that different.
Quote:
See, now that is just a shining example of how to discuss the issue at hand. I mean only total schmucks resort to ad hominem attacks and avoid the issue altogether,
|
Well, name a 'good' and respected PvE'er who is purely, 100%, at all times, PvE. I'm interested.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bungusmaximus
You can also exploit weak spots in PvE, such as a monster using frenzy all of a sudden. Whack him once or twice and he's dead twice as fast as the other monster, so guess what i will smash in such a situation.
You have a point there. Target calling does exist in PvE to an extent, but you said it right when you mentioned it is far more straightfoward.
Quote:
I think only 25% of the GW community is actually good at the game, wether it's PvP or PvE doesn't matter.
I think that's pretty optimistic. Less than 25% of the PvP community is good at PvP, and that doesn't take into account the vast majority of other players.
25 Sep 2007 at 10:09 - 380
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avarre
Well, name a 'good' and respected PvE'er who is purely, 100%, at all times, PvE
Um, good by which measure? Respected by whom? There's no ranking on the PvE side except for the largely pointless challenge missions and if you're reasonably competent at smashing face there's actually a big disincentive to interact much with the larger player base, so there won't be anybody to witness your deeds
Also, I believe that the claim that irks some people is that only PvP can make you a good player. As I said elsewhere, this depends on the definition of 'good player', and people might be getting confused over the cause and the effect as well.
25 Sep 2007 at 10:12 - 381
sweeet another cry baby wimp...geez
25 Sep 2007 at 11:45 - 382
It is all so perfectly clear to me now.
You PvP gurus are realizing that you have spent the better part of what, 2 years of your life in this game, and these forums are the only place where you can get any recognition for that 2 year commitment because nobody else in the world cares. So here you are, demanding respect for your decision to spend 4,672 hours playing GW, when that 4,672 hours could have been spent with a person of the opposite gender, and all you have to offer people asking for help is "u suck lrn2playnoob"? Yeah, that sure is documented proof of your hard-won knowledge there.
No wonder you guys are so ill-mannered and defensive about PvP - because if you knew then what you knew now, that all this time would result in forumites reading your claims of 4,672 hours and questioning your judgement, social skills, and decision-making process that resulted in 4,672 hours in here? So you claim to be PvP experts that breathe rarefied air beyond the comprehension of normal people in some vain attempt to salvage something from this 4,672 hour commitment which has resulted in what?
And slowly, ANet is taking away the crown jewels of PvP - like say Favor? That must really stick in your craw.
Yeah, if I was in your position, I'd be bitter and feel like I was owed something too - but you made the choice, and it is not my or anyone elses fault that your poor decision results in you getting little respect for your decision to spend 4,672 hours playing this game. What were you thinking? That you would get others to believe that you have skills in GW beyond the norm, or just a sad desire for respect for the one thing you have done for the last 2 years?
If a boy told me that he had spent 4,672 hours playing with the paddleball, and then demanded that I respect his skills with it, when I did that paddleball silliness years ago and found it strangely lacking, and saw how shallow it was, well of course I would think him silly when he would say that the paddleball takes nuances on the rubber band connecting the paddle and the ball. Whoop te doo. He's got to make the best of what he's got, right? So, counting down to everyone pressing the "3" key does not require the equivalent of a PhD.
Yeah, I'd be bitter too. Take this as the shock that you people need - this game is going away soon. It will all go up in a poof of electronic smoke.
I would suggest that you go try spending time with a person of whatever gender you prefer, and let me tell you, if you think PvP is involved and complex, just wait till you try relationships.
Thanks!
TabascoSauce
PS- wanna talk about the difficulty of PvE and how to help players? I'd recommend maybe reading Hanoks post, because he is seriously trying to further the subject instead of bickering like we all are.
25 Sep 2007 at 12:01 - 383
Quote:
Originally Posted by TabascoSauce
It is all so perfectly clear to me now.
You PvP gurus are realizing that you have spent the better part of what, 2 years of your life in this game, and these forums are the only place where you can get any recognition for that 2 year commitment because nobody else in the world cares. So here you are, demanding respect for your decision to spend 4,672 hours playing GW, when that 4,672 hours could have been spent with a person of the opposite gender, and all you have to offer people asking for help is "u suck lrn2playnoob"? Yeah, that sure is documented proof of your hard-won knowledge there.
No wonder you guys are so ill-mannered and defensive about PvP - because if you knew then what you knew now, that all this time would result in forumites reading your claims of 4,672 hours and questioning your judgement, social skills, and decision-making process that resulted in 4,672 hours in here? So you claim to be PvP experts that breathe rarefied air beyond the comprehension of normal people in some vain attempt to salvage something from this 4,672 hour commitment which has resulted in what?
And slowly, ANet is taking away the crown jewels of PvP - like say Favor? That must really stick in your craw.
Yeah, if I was in your position, I'd be bitter and feel like I was owed something too - but you made the choice, and it is not my or anyone elses fault that your poor decision results in you getting little respect for your decision to spend 4,672 hours playing this game. What were you thinking? That you would get others to believe that you have skills in GW beyond the norm, or just a sad desire for respect for the one thing you have done for the last 2 years?
If a boy told me that he had spent 4,672 hours playing with the paddleball, and then demanded that I respect his skills with it, when I did that paddleball silliness years ago and found it strangely lacking, and saw how shallow it was, well of course I would think him silly when he would say that the paddleball takes nuances on the rubber band connecting the paddle and the ball. Whoop te doo. He's got to make the best of what he's got, right? So, counting down to everyone pressing the "3" key does not require the equivalent of a PhD.
Yeah, I'd be bitter too. Take this as the shock that you people need - this game is going away soon. It will all go up in a poof of electronic smoke.
I would suggest that you go try spending time with a person of whatever gender you prefer, and let me tell you, if you think PvP is involved and complex, just wait till you try relationships.
Thanks!
TabascoSauce
PS- wanna talk about the difficulty of PvE and how to help players? I'd recommend maybe reading Hanoks post, because he is seriously trying to further the subject instead of bickering like we all are.
Hah ahahha a !
I never laughed so hard! This post wins all guru thread from 2 years.
Well...
I would thank you for making a real reality check for people here. On a side note, I'm that kind of casual player that loves video games but has a wife and a job.
I'm sick that A-Net stopped to support us (people that have not so much time to play) to support grinders.
GW will end for me as soons as they close servers. I hope there will be a beautiful game online soon that doesn't require so much of my time to complete at the fullest.
25 Sep 2007 at 12:20 - 384
Quote:
Originally Posted by TabascoSauce
- lots of words to increase post count -
Man, I have a feeling you were writing this long speech the whole night and then rehearsing it entire morning in front of a mirror. Then, having satisfied you ego and having convinced yourself how smart and brilliant you are you copy-pasted your well-written BS from Word into this forum
Well done. You really should get a job as a speech writer for presidents, man!
If I'm not mistaken, you were the one who was arguing with several experienced people claiming that elementalists make better minion masters then necros themselves, lol. That thread was also full of your "so smart" and yet completely non-sense statements
You're not PvPer, ok, but are you any good in PvE then? What have you created / achieved in PvE? Sab, at least, has made this PvE build - http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s....php?p=3166969 and shared it with community. The build rocks! Do you have anything similar to contribute, apart from your so impolite, so self-enamoured and so long speeches?
25 Sep 2007 at 14:00 - 385
Tabasco, I really tried to take you seriously. I really tried to read your post without automatically thinking you were an inexperienced idiot. But then you said this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by TabascoSauce
And slowly, ANet is taking away the crown jewels of PvP - like say Favor? That must really stick in your craw.
You are either very stupid, or extremely naive. Or possibly both. And, off-topic, you talk about spending time with "the opposite gender" a lot. Might you possibly be single and a virgin?
25 Sep 2007 at 16:07 - 386
response to op.
normal mode pve is so ridiculously easy that im finding it hard to believe someone with 2+ years of experience is having difficulty with it. whatever the case is, tweaking your team build for any semblance of synergy will get the job done. people have posted specific builds you can use so ill leave it at that.
to all the pve v pvp posters.
any experience in high-end pvp will make you a better pver. i cant say the same for high-end pve making you a better pvper.
in regards to player experience, regardless of how shallow or deep you consider it to be, experience will ultimately make you a more refined player. the learning curve is going to vary person to person but to write it off almost entirely is being somewhat naive.
25 Sep 2007 at 16:36 - 387
Quote:
Originally Posted by Faer
Tabasco, I really tried to take you seriously. I really tried to read your post without automatically thinking you were an inexperienced idiot. But then you said this:
You are either very stupid, or extremely naive. Or possibly both. And, off-topic, you talk about spending time with "the opposite gender" a lot. Might you possibly be single and a virgin?
Forum moderators shouldn't fall into the trap of responding to childish posts by making inappropriate posts themselves. As a moderator you must show a level of restraint that most posters don't.
25 Sep 2007 at 17:21 - 388
How does one respond to a post like, "you sound like an idiot".....
The children posts aside this is all very simply a case of everyone thinking they are the best and most knowledgeable in all aspects of a game.
Yes this is just a game.
If you really think spending 1000+ hours playing pvp gives you some insight that somebody that is familiar with the game and knows all skills and there uses doesnt know your just fooling yourself.
Stating that since the AI can't adapt to people as a reason that pvp teaches you something that does not apply in pve is a joke.
The AI doesnt need to adapt. It doesnt care if it wins or loses. Its just a game.
A good player is a good player regardless what area of GW they are in.
Saying that a pvp player does better in pve that somebody that never pvp's makes no sense at all. A good player will win, its just that simple.
Taking a pvp build into most areas will work, simply taking 8 live people with random skill bars will work. That proves nothing.
PvP players have a "I must win" mentalitly that can make them very anoying. In PvE most of us just want to have fun. Sometimes that means we use a bad build and have to strugle forward with 60%dp.
I am certain that a PvP player will post that I suck and that they have never had to struggle with any dp because they are so good, but who cares. I like to have fun, thats why I play the game and do not worry or get stressed out wheater or not my build is perfect or my party or if we are working in perfect harmony. This is a GAME. Play for fun, play to kill time, but stop posting here and just go PLAY!!
25 Sep 2007 at 17:40 - 389
Quote:
Originally Posted by TabascoSauce
It is all so perfectly clear to me now.
You PvP gurus are realizing that you have spent the better part of what, 2 years of your life in this game, and these forums are the only place where you can get any recognition for that 2 year commitment because nobody else in the world cares. So here you are, demanding respect for your decision to spend 4,672 hours playing GW, when that 4,672 hours could have been spent with a person of the opposite gender, and all you have to offer people asking for help is "u suck lrn2playnoob"? Yeah, that sure is documented proof of your hard-won knowledge there.
No wonder you guys are so ill-mannered and defensive about PvP - because if you knew then what you knew now, that all this time would result in forumites reading your claims of 4,672 hours and questioning your judgement, social skills, and decision-making process that resulted in 4,672 hours in here? So you claim to be PvP experts that breathe rarefied air beyond the comprehension of normal people in some vain attempt to salvage something from this 4,672 hour commitment which has resulted in what?
And slowly, ANet is taking away the crown jewels of PvP - like say Favor? That must really stick in your craw.
Yeah, if I was in your position, I'd be bitter and feel like I was owed something too - but you made the choice, and it is not my or anyone elses fault that your poor decision results in you getting little respect for your decision to spend 4,672 hours playing this game. What were you thinking? That you would get others to believe that you have skills in GW beyond the norm, or just a sad desire for respect for the one thing you have done for the last 2 years?
If a boy told me that he had spent 4,672 hours playing with the paddleball, and then demanded that I respect his skills with it, when I did that paddleball silliness years ago and found it strangely lacking, and saw how shallow it was, well of course I would think him silly when he would say that the paddleball takes nuances on the rubber band connecting the paddle and the ball. Whoop te doo. He's got to make the best of what he's got, right? So, counting down to everyone pressing the "3" key does not require the equivalent of a PhD.
Yeah, I'd be bitter too. Take this as the shock that you people need - this game is going away soon. It will all go up in a poof of electronic smoke.
I would suggest that you go try spending time with a person of whatever gender you prefer, and let me tell you, if you think PvP is involved and complex, just wait till you try relationships.
Thanks!
TabascoSauce
PS- wanna talk about the difficulty of PvE and how to help players? I'd recommend maybe reading Hanoks post, because he is seriously trying to further the subject instead of bickering like we all are.
There shouldn't be a discussion.
I've been playing this game for a year. It's not difficult in the PvE aspect. It's simply not. Sure, I've had a roadblock or two with some Hardmode missions, but that's my business. Normal mode PvE is embarassingly easy. C'mon.
Again, if you complain about NM PvE, post your build. So we can rip it apart and explain why you're not doing well.
Stop running your shit builds and learn to be unoriginal. Conformity isn't such a terrible thing every once in a whole.
25 Sep 2007 at 17:41 - 390
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeraCombi
Forum moderators shouldn't fall into the trap of responding to childish posts by making inappropriate posts themselves. As a moderator you must show a level of restraint that most posters don't.
Except....he's stating the truth. There's no actual valid reason people should have problems. Much less make idiotic statements.
25 Sep 2007 at 18:17 - 391
Wow. For all the mocking that happens towards newer or less experienced players, "lrn2play", "PvE is too easy", "you are just a bad player" and all that, you lot sure get mad when you are the subject of the mockery.
Thanks!
TabascoSauce
25 Sep 2007 at 19:49 - 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by TabascoSauce
You PvP gurus are realizing that you have spent the better part of what, 2 years of your life in this game, and these forums are the only place where you can get any recognition for that 2 year commitment because nobody else in the world cares.
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This is ironic, because not only have you stated in a previous post that you've been playing this game for 2 years, but you also write 10 essays a day on these forums, on this topic alone. Guess what? When this game goes away in a puff of electronic smoke (along with your 2 years of playing), so will these forums and your essays.
I do wonder what makes you so bitter at everyone and everything in computer games such as this one. They are, after all, just a hobby. A normal person who didn't like a game or some aspect of it, would just move on. You seem to have some personal issue, though, that requires that you post essay after essay, flaming away at people playing one aspect of the game (pvp in this case). I suggest you seek psychological help. Really.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by TabascoSauce
I would suggest that you go try spending time with a person of whatever gender you prefer, and let me tell you, if you think PvP is involved and complex, just wait till you try relationships.
Congratulations on your first relationship (really!). The reason I can tell it is your first one, is that relationships are a normal activity that the vast majority of humans participate in, and not really something worthy of running to a message board to post about.
25 Sep 2007 at 20:09 - 393
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snow Bunny
Sure, I've had a roadblock or two with some Hardmode missions, but that's my business. Normal mode PvE is embarassingly easy. C'mon.
Enough of this careless responsibility for your own shortcomings. Clearly you got stuck because anet is bad at the game, you're an elitist, and PvPers eat toddlers while breaking the game. Or something. Did I get that right Tabasco?
26 Sep 2007 at 04:08 - 394
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gigashadow
This is ironic, because not only have you stated in a previous post that you've been playing this game for 2 years, but you also write 10 essays a day on these forums, on this topic alone. Guess what? When this game goes away in a puff of electronic smoke (along with your 2 years of playing), so will these forums and your essays.
I do wonder what makes you so bitter at everyone and everything in computer games such as this one. They are, after all, just a hobby. A normal person who didn't like a game or some aspect of it, would just move on. You seem to have some personal issue, though, that requires that you post essay after essay, flaming away at people playing one aspect of the game (pvp in this case). I suggest you seek psychological help. Really.
Congratulations on your first relationship (really!). The reason I can tell it is your first one, is that relationships are a normal activity that the vast majority of humans participate in, and not really something worthy of running to a message board to post about.
Well, I am not really bitter, in the context you are referring to. Every time I read this thread, I see two distinct "sides", to put it bluntly.
I see that specifically, Hanok Odbrook for his multitude of helpful supportive posts, and many others too numerous to mention that I really ought to because they are trying to form the basis of what GW should have - a community. They are trying to understand what is bothering the OP, and help him past his frustration to find what we have found in the game - challenging fun. This is a really fun game, all complaints aside, and has given a fantastic value for the money.
On the other side, I see just as many posters who should hang their heads in shame, for the useless posts that actually hurt the community, as far as I am concerned. I have seen many of these posters elsewhere in these forums, and I'm sad to say that a majority of them have boasted, in this thread and elsewhere, of PvP prowess and how that makes them superior players, so "STFU & lrn2play noob". They use this as some kind of shield or justification to exempt them from acting in a conscientious manner, and choose the path of condescension and ridicule.
I'm not buying it anymore. Whether they are superior or no, they are definitely not willing to go any farther than saying some insipid variant on the words "you fail" and/or "you suck". Their demands of respect are the basest form of elitism and an attempt to "class" the forum into what, the smarties and the losers?
I'll put it bluntly - if they are willing to dish it out, then they should be willing to take it. If I can shake them out of believing that anything, and I mean anything, gives them the justification to post such mean spirited rhetoric, then I'll take whatever vain attempt to put me down you have to say as a result. Go back to page 1 of this thread, and you'll see some of those posters are still here, and I'm obviously causing them distress. And it is not just a few bad eggs here.
If you think this is a stunt, you would be correct. I see pages and pages of people (Hi Hanok & Co) trying to outdo their acidic comments with logic and reason. Heck, I even tried for a while, and it was not working. So I figured I would try shock.
Now do you think I have your attention?
The PvP subculture in GW is making no attempt that I see to police their members from this kind of behavior, and while it may or may not be their job, there needs to be some way of making posters aware that if they, for all their good intentions (if they have any), want to be leaders and respected in this community they need to find a different way to express themselves than "Fail". Particularly if they are truly experienced in the game, they have no excuse to ridicule newer or less experienced members.
I see Sab (for his thread right now), and Avarre, and Ensign, and others have posted builds and are being helpful in their own way, and my hat is off to them. I'd say it is fair to say that I have less time to play the game and post in these forums than they do, and AFAIC they are giving back to the community. That is leadership. We might not always agree, but this is a forum - it happens.
If any of you have not posted bile and ridicule, then I'll offer my sincere apologies if I have offended you. For those who have, think of this as my way to get your attention and show you how it feels to be attacked. Please, please think twice before you post "U suck". Not only is that it makes the jobs of Hanok, Chthon, Chthulhu Reborn, and others still to numerous to mention, harder, but you leave a lasting impression to the OP.
Go ahead and tell me I am a grandstanding son of a gun. I do not mind, because it is true. I'll do this rather than sit by and let it happen - whether it works or not, I tried.
Thanks!
TabascoSauce
26 Sep 2007 at 04:39 - 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by TabascoSauce
It is all so perfectly clear to me now.
You PvP gurus are realizing that you have spent the better part of what, 2 years of your life in this game, and these forums are the only place where you can get any recognition for that 2 year commitment because nobody else in the world cares. So here you are, demanding respect for your decision to spend 4,672 hours playing GW, when that 4,672 hours could have been spent with a person of the opposite gender, and all you have to offer people asking for help is "u suck lrn2playnoob"? Yeah, that sure is documented proof of your hard-won knowledge there.
No wonder you guys are so ill-mannered and defensive about PvP - because if you knew then what you knew now, that all this time would result in forumites reading your claims of 4,672 hours and questioning your judgement, social skills, and decision-making process that resulted in 4,672 hours in here? So you claim to be PvP experts that breathe rarefied air beyond the comprehension of normal people in some vain attempt to salvage something from this 4,672 hour commitment which has resulted in what?
And slowly, ANet is taking away the crown jewels of PvP - like say Favor? That must really stick in your craw.
Yeah, if I was in your position, I'd be bitter and feel like I was owed something too - but you made the choice, and it is not my or anyone elses fault that your poor decision results in you getting little respect for your decision to spend 4,672 hours playing this game. What were you thinking? That you would get others to believe that you have skills in GW beyond the norm, or just a sad desire for respect for the one thing you have done for the last 2 years?
If a boy told me that he had spent 4,672 hours playing with the paddleball, and then demanded that I respect his skills with it, when I did that paddleball silliness years ago and found it strangely lacking, and saw how shallow it was, well of course I would think him silly when he would say that the paddleball takes nuances on the rubber band connecting the paddle and the ball. Whoop te doo. He's got to make the best of what he's got, right? So, counting down to everyone pressing the "3" key does not require the equivalent of a PhD.
Yeah, I'd be bitter too. Take this as the shock that you people need - this game is going away soon. It will all go up in a poof of electronic smoke.
I would suggest that you go try spending time with a person of whatever gender you prefer, and let me tell you, if you think PvP is involved and complex, just wait till you try relationships.
Thanks!
TabascoSauce
PS- wanna talk about the difficulty of PvE and how to help players? I'd recommend maybe reading Hanoks post, because he is seriously trying to further the subject instead of bickering like we all are.
26 Sep 2007 at 05:19 - 396
TabascoSauce, your arguments suck, your understanding of the basis of GW's mechanics suck, and its no surprise that this thread has degenerated into what it is now with you constantly spewing your crap.
Try posting your builds and the 'evil PvP elitist AGAINST ME' people will break it down for you and explain why you suck, so you can be better.
Or just write another meaningless wall of words with plenty of passive-aggressive content and futile attempts to paint us as a horde of angry people hellbent on crushing you.
Witless fool -.-
26 Sep 2007 at 05:31 - 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crom The Pale
If you really think spending 1000+ hours playing pvp gives you some insight that somebody that is familiar with the game and knows all skills and there uses doesnt know your just fooling yourself.
Stating that since the AI can't adapt to people as a reason that pvp teaches you something that does not apply in pve is a joke.
The AI doesnt need to adapt. It doesnt care if it wins or loses. Its just a game.
A good player is a good player regardless what area of GW they are in.
Saying that a pvp player does better in pve that somebody that never pvp's makes no sense at all. A good player will win, its just that simple.
Taking a pvp build into most areas will work, simply taking 8 live people with random skill bars will work. That proves nothing.
PvP players have a "I must win" mentalitly that can make them very anoying. In PvE most of us just want to have fun. Sometimes that means we use a bad build and have to strugle forward with 60%dp.
I am certain that a PvP player will post that I suck and that they have never had to struggle with any dp because they are so good, but who cares. I like to have fun, thats why I play the game and do not worry or get stressed out wheater or not my build is perfect or my party or if we are working in perfect harmony. This is a GAME. Play for fun, play to kill time, but stop posting here and just go PLAY!!
I've done the experiment: took a group of smart PvP players (not even the "best" of the PvPers) and easily completed The Deep in HM, then proceeded to vanquish some of the hardest zones with many heroes.
Then I took a group of "great PvEers" into GvG (note: many of which have IVI+ or legendary vanquisher). Struggled to even beat teams with rating 990.
There's the proof you whiners want. Being good at PvE doesn't mean you'll be good at all in PvP, but being good at PvP means you'll be relatively good in PvE.
26 Sep 2007 at 05:36 - 398
Quote:
Originally Posted by Faer
Tabasco, I really tried to take you seriously. I really tried to read your post without automatically thinking you were an inexperienced idiot. But then you said this:
You are either very stupid, or extremely naive. Or possibly both. And, off-topic, you talk about spending time with "the opposite gender" a lot. Might you possibly be single and a virgin?
I lol'ed in real life. Tabasco is pretty bad. Yeah.
26 Sep 2007 at 05:40 - 399
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avarre
I have, combined, well over 20 million experience on various chars, mainly on a Mesmer. I have PKM on that mes, as well as several other titles at various stages, including grind titles like Treasure Hunter (6). I have written PvE articles on game theory, designed farming builds years ago with SMS, cleared FoW with 3 men back in 2005. I have full fissure earned solo/duo farming UW, and multiple tormented items.
What exactly is your point of calling me a 'PvPer'? I've done more PvE than PvP. Sab's story isn't that different.
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Where did I mention your name in my post? Exactly, I didn't.
My beef is with a certain attitude where some PvP ers seem to have a holier than thou attitude.
Sab says as much as that PvP ers are better than PvE ers. And there are some who subscribe to this. Whether someone plays more PvE or PvP is irrelevant to me. I do not like the condescending comments that are being made from a PvP point of view that say that PvE ers are supposedly lesser people than PvP ers. If you do not subscribe to that point of view then my comments have nothing to do with you.
26 Sep 2007 at 05:44 - 400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Faer
Tabasco, I really tried to take you seriously. I really tried to read your post without automatically thinking you were an inexperienced idiot. But then you said this:
You are either very stupid, or extremely naive. Or possibly both. And, off-topic, you talk about spending time with "the opposite gender" a lot. Might you possibly be single and a virgin?
With all due respect but isn't this the type of post the forum rules are asking us to stay away from? Or was it on another forum where people are asked to stay away from calling people things like stupid and attacking their personal life?
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