even if u got 7 heros it woudent make it much better then a team with human ppl. example norn farming. cant be done fast if u aint got 5-6 ursan ppl. and heros cant take any pve-only skill on.
so in the end ppl still need to find a team of real ppl
A discussion on 7 heroes
VOTD
credit
I might do some PvE with some crazy spikes, would be cool.
/sign
/sign
Crom The Pale
Ah this thread never will die 
To add more of my 2cents(think I'm up to about $17.22 by now actually)...
Heros were one of the first chances players in the game had to experiment with Party builds as opposed to character builds. Out side of PvP players almost never concidered how there own build would integrate with thier parties build, untill they had to set up heros to work with their builds.
While not everyone playing with heros learned this little lessen I think a great deal did and it is shown by how often people ask not just about what other player builds are when they join a PuG but are willing to adapt thier own builds to fit in better.
This type of understanding never existed before and I feel with 7 heros people would gain a better understanding of how a full party can be integrated to work much better than just a group of 8 people playing thier favorite builds.
To add more of my 2cents(think I'm up to about $17.22 by now actually)...
Heros were one of the first chances players in the game had to experiment with Party builds as opposed to character builds. Out side of PvP players almost never concidered how there own build would integrate with thier parties build, untill they had to set up heros to work with their builds.
While not everyone playing with heros learned this little lessen I think a great deal did and it is shown by how often people ask not just about what other player builds are when they join a PuG but are willing to adapt thier own builds to fit in better.
This type of understanding never existed before and I feel with 7 heros people would gain a better understanding of how a full party can be integrated to work much better than just a group of 8 people playing thier favorite builds.
wanmoke
2 Cents.
They've already said no, my opinion is it would be nice, but, they've said no. I don't play with real people anymore really. To me, GW is just one biiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiig single player game.
They've already said no, my opinion is it would be nice, but, they've said no. I don't play with real people anymore really. To me, GW is just one biiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiig single player game.
Biostem
Competent human players will be better than any AI-controlled character, be they hero or henchmen. The problem, of course, is the competent part. Since that is a crapshoot at best w/ PUGs, heroes are the next best thing...
Zahr Dalsk
My 2 dollars.
This refusal to add heroes is obstinate, stubborn, and pointless. Their precious developer vision has already died.
As for humans... very few are better than my heroes, so yeah.
This refusal to add heroes is obstinate, stubborn, and pointless. Their precious developer vision has already died.
As for humans... very few are better than my heroes, so yeah.
enter_the_zone
I want 7 heroes.
Why? Because when GW2 comes out, I defy Anet to show me a decent Pug for HM missions.
Actually, sod that, I defy Anet to show me a decent Pug for HM missions NOW.
Heroes are good, but they don't compensate for the /fail of henchmen.
Maybe if they buffed henches to have decent skill bars and second professions like even the monsters do in HM.....but logic fails Anet, as usual.
Why? Because when GW2 comes out, I defy Anet to show me a decent Pug for HM missions.
Actually, sod that, I defy Anet to show me a decent Pug for HM missions NOW.
Heroes are good, but they don't compensate for the /fail of henchmen.
Maybe if they buffed henches to have decent skill bars and second professions like even the monsters do in HM.....but logic fails Anet, as usual.
Cathode_Reborn
I play GW for what it revoles around - skills, builds, teamplay, cooperation, etcetc.
I'm a pve player and I like testing and tweaking good builds. Being able to only mess with 3 heroes is really......boring, and lame. You can't really grab 7 random people to test some build and make them run each build with all exact skills/attributes. Sure, you could if it was an organized PvP guild and people had reason to do what you say, but....were talking PvE here, that doesn't really happen.
Being forced to use those henchmen whose bars are purposely made of bad quality was a very poor and lazy attempt to "gently encourage pugs", quoting Anet. With EotN's release, people pug plenty of times now with their button-mashing no-skill elite known as Ursan. If they're not gonna give us 7 heroes, at least add an additional 1 or 2.
Again, there's lots of random team setups that I, and I'm sure many others would like to try out. I imagine this change would probably slightly decrease the amount of players that pug but, is there something wrong with that? If they're enjoying the game in a perfectly fine way, why take that away from them? If Anet wants to "gently encourage pugs", you need to add reason to join those pugs, not take away or limit options to players. Ursan added reason to pug. It was a step in the right direction if they wanted players to pug more, even thought it encourages very mindless play. Limiting PvE players to only 3 heroes from the start wasn't the way to go.
I'm a pve player and I like testing and tweaking good builds. Being able to only mess with 3 heroes is really......boring, and lame. You can't really grab 7 random people to test some build and make them run each build with all exact skills/attributes. Sure, you could if it was an organized PvP guild and people had reason to do what you say, but....were talking PvE here, that doesn't really happen.
Being forced to use those henchmen whose bars are purposely made of bad quality was a very poor and lazy attempt to "gently encourage pugs", quoting Anet. With EotN's release, people pug plenty of times now with their button-mashing no-skill elite known as Ursan. If they're not gonna give us 7 heroes, at least add an additional 1 or 2.
Again, there's lots of random team setups that I, and I'm sure many others would like to try out. I imagine this change would probably slightly decrease the amount of players that pug but, is there something wrong with that? If they're enjoying the game in a perfectly fine way, why take that away from them? If Anet wants to "gently encourage pugs", you need to add reason to join those pugs, not take away or limit options to players. Ursan added reason to pug. It was a step in the right direction if they wanted players to pug more, even thought it encourages very mindless play. Limiting PvE players to only 3 heroes from the start wasn't the way to go.
Kityn
I say no to 7 heroes. 3 useful hench with 3 heroes and yourself is plenty to take on much of Guild Wars. I used to think having 7 heroes would be a neat idea. But I have since changed my mind. All depends on what builds you use. Having 7 heroes would just about roll over anything and that is not much of a challenge at all.
enter_the_zone
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Cathode_Reborn
I play GW for what it revoles around - skills, builds, teamplay, cooperation, etcetc.
I'm a pve player and I like testing and tweaking good builds. Being able to only mess with 3 heroes is really......boring, and lame. You can't really grab 7 random people to test some build and make them run each build with all exact skills/attributes. Sure, you could if it was an organized PvP guild and people had reason to do what you say, but....were talking PvE here, that doesn't really happen. Being forced to use those henchmen whose bars are purposely made of bad quality was a very poor and lazy attempt to "gently encourage pugs", quoting Anet. With EotN's release, people pug plenty of times now with their button-mashing no-skill elite known as Ursan. If they're not gonna give us 7 heroes, at least add an additional 1 or 2. Again, there's lots of random team setups that I, and I'm sure many others would like to try out. I imagine this change would probably slightly decrease the amount of players that pug but, is there something wrong with that? If they're enjoying the game in a perfectly fine way, why take that away from them? If Anet wants to "gently encourage pugs", you need to add reason to join those pugs, not take away or limit options to players. Ursan added reason to pug. It was a step in the right direction if they wanted players to pug more, even thought it encourages very mindless play. Limiting PvE players to only 3 heroes from the start wasn't the way to go. |
On the other hand, I'd pay upto £30 to unlock the "extra" hero slots. I really hate pugs.
TheLichMonky
It would make pve even easier -_-
RedNova88
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Originally Posted by wanmoke
2 Cents.
They've already said no, my opinion is it would be nice, but, they've said no. I don't play with real people anymore really. To me, GW is just one biiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiig single player game. |
I know that they've said no, but honestly it's probably inevitable. Even games like EQ that are still going dumbed down the game massive amounts so that newbies could jump in and have an easier time. So honestly I can see them implementing it after GW2 is released, and if it does well enough to really attract people from GW1 to it (and to stay with it).
Tyla
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Originally Posted by TheLichMonky
It would make pve even easier -_-
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Originally Posted by VOTD
even if u got 7 heros it woudent make it much better then a team with human ppl. example norn farming. cant be done fast if u aint got 5-6 ursan ppl. and heros cant take any pve-only skill on.
so in the end ppl still need to find a team of real ppl |
And not everyone wants to run Ursan tbh.
Good job I got a few mates and guildies so I don't have to take those uber bad henchmen all the time for vq...
Pandora's box
Stop thinking in black & white. It's already stated that we don't get an all hero team. What about... 4 heroes? 
It would fairly cover most of the mistakes henchies or pugs make, stimulate creativity to make skill combo's and free the way to create a balanced team with more professions.
It would fairly cover most of the mistakes henchies or pugs make, stimulate creativity to make skill combo's and free the way to create a balanced team with more professions.
Nevin
My simple in put for I don't want to cause any controversy or giant lecture posts.
As the population of GW1 players decline, options of play outside of NPC's will diminish. Thus I believe at some point the ability of 7 heroes should be added, how ever slowly. Such as 1 every 2-3 months, because when GW2 comes.. Honestly. Thats gunna slice the player basis in half, I'm sure many of us will leave GW1 on our comps... But only to go back and title grind a title that has a neat reward in GW2.
As the population of GW1 players decline, options of play outside of NPC's will diminish. Thus I believe at some point the ability of 7 heroes should be added, how ever slowly. Such as 1 every 2-3 months, because when GW2 comes.. Honestly. Thats gunna slice the player basis in half, I'm sure many of us will leave GW1 on our comps... But only to go back and title grind a title that has a neat reward in GW2.
zwei2stein
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Pandora's box
Stop thinking in black & white. It's already stated that we don't get an all hero team. What about... 4 heroes?
It would fairly cover most of the mistakes henchies or pugs make, stimulate creativity to make skill combo's and free the way to create a balanced team with more professions. |
Full team in 6man area, ability to form Urgoz team with only two players
DarkGanni
Quote:
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Originally Posted by zwei2stein
What about 5 heroes?
Full team in 6man area, ability to form Urgoz team with only two players |
/signed
Splitisoda
I /sign for 7 heroes. Think about the great builds you can come up with, besides, I wan't to see ANYONE pug AND win Gate of Madness.
The negative sides to heroes is, that the human is the only one who can use pve skills. That's why it wouldn't be bad, because then you wouldn't see easy 6 hero ursan groups.
The negative sides to heroes is, that the human is the only one who can use pve skills. That's why it wouldn't be bad, because then you wouldn't see easy 6 hero ursan groups.
Balan Makki
For Hardmode yes, I would like having 7 heroes. Mostly, I only get to play the game in short spells. This would help casual players like me who aren't on long enough find or organize a group. As well, I'm constantly needing to give my family attention (AFKing) while gaming, so grouping, once again, is out of the question most of the time--I only get to group around 10%-20% of my game time.
I do like grouping, and good company. Unfortunately, my life is a bit to busy to afford this luxury.
I do like grouping, and good company. Unfortunately, my life is a bit to busy to afford this luxury.
T1Cybernetic
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Balan Makki
For Hardmode yes, I would like having 7 heroes. Mostly, I only get to play the game in short spells. This would help casual players like me who aren't on long enough find or organize a group. As well, I'm constantly needing to give my family attention (AFKing) while gaming, so grouping, once again, is out of the question most of the time--I only get to group around 10%-20% of my game time.
I do like grouping, and good company. Unfortunately, my life is a bit to busy to afford this luxury. |
Lishy
More heroes in the team would be nice, but Anet already said no.
...Maybe for GW2.
/halfsigned.
...Maybe for GW2.
/halfsigned.
Balan Makki
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Originally Posted by T1Cybernetic
Im with you on that
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GW1 is the first online game that tends towards this convenience. This appears to be an Arena Net market strategy. Having greater access is always a good thing.
I'd even be willing to buy a second account for a full Hero feature.
If Arena Net does something like this they should at least make money by it.
Pleikki
I would like play with 7 heroes tbh it would be too easy 
even with 3 heroes its easy.. some challenge guys imo! its fun do some areas just With henchs Like thk with bonus its amazing fun nah my opinion is From 3 to 1 hero WTF!
Gun Pierson
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Originally Posted by Pleikki
I would like play with 7 heroes tbh it would be too easy
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On a more serious note...After the revival of this thread for the xx time and after reading some new posts, I can only conclude that the first valid argument why not to have 7 heroes is still to be found.
I did read every post in this thread like many others as 'arcanacabre' etc. I should have made a list last months keeping track of all the arguments and counterarguments, but I didn't. It's all in here though if you have a few days spare time.
It would be nice to get some more feedback from arenanet on this, but who'm I kidding.
They should make both sides happy. Give people the use of 7 heroes and in the meantime install a pug district like we have 'america', international' etc where people who like to pug find eachother easely. Possibly giving pug groups in the pug district a small bonus or more gold drops or something when they play. Just an idea.
Zahr Dalsk
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Originally Posted by Red Sonya
Lol Melon that number 2 you said was funny. Ain't gonna be any 7 heroes though...Anet is showing they want to move away from AI play and more into group play as GW2 information is coming out. You have enough heroes with 3 and 4 henchies.
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Aera Lure
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Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk
Are they too blind to realize that we will either play with AI, or quit the game rather than do PUGs?
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odly
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Originally Posted by Kain Fz
More heroes in the team would be nice, but Anet already said no.
...Maybe for GW2. /halfsigned. |
Kos Luftar
The only reason why anyone would want more heros is because they are having a hard time with some parts of the game.
PVE is funny easy if you just spend some time setting up the 3 heros.
/not signed (lern to play the game better and stop whinning)
PVE is funny easy if you just spend some time setting up the 3 heros.
/not signed (lern to play the game better and stop whinning)
Dwimmerlaik
7 flags scares me =/
Gun Pierson
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Originally Posted by Kos Luftar
The only reason why anyone would want more heros is because they are having a hard time with some parts of the game.
PVE is funny easy if you just spend some time setting up the 3 heros. /not signed (lern to play the game better and stop whinning) |
Next time, if you want to contribute at a serieus level, I suggest you know at least the basic things that's been said in this topic before talking out of the ass.
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Originally Posted by Dwimmerlaik
7 flags scares me =/
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Paloma Song
Anet will change their minds eventually, as the game continues to decline, and allow 7 heroes as they should've all along. No doubt sometime after most of us have long since quit.
Uber Mass
No thnx PvE is easy enough as it is
Zamochit
They would have to totally change the current flagging system, and I dont want to imagine what would happen in HoH if seven heros were implemented....
Shadowmere
While it would be very nice (especially considering we have, what, 16 heroes now?) I can see the reasons for it not being allowed, maybe for hard mode only?
Really though, I've disliked having to equip heroes since the beginning, I made 1 character why do I suddenly have to be equipping 10 other ones?!?
Really though, I've disliked having to equip heroes since the beginning, I made 1 character why do I suddenly have to be equipping 10 other ones?!?
pygar
Quote:
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Originally Posted by odly
I'm afraid I have to disapoint you. There won't be any heroes in GW2.
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Myself, I am on the fence on this issue.... I just beat the Gate of Madness with Heroes and Henchies (with Master bonus no less) , so not like I need the extra heroes to get by. I would of course like the extra heroes over the Henchies because it gives you more options, and I like to outfit them and tweak their builds (I get to learn about other classes and their skills w/out making new characters that way)
I understand the plight of people who prefer to play the game with groups, but have a hard time finding them- but myself I absolutely hate PUGs, the only good thing I have to say about the few times I did join a group was seeing that group fail usually showed me exactly what I needed to do so that I could go back and beat the mission on the next try with my H&H team.
I am sad to hear that they are moving away from Heroes and Henchies in GW2, I think that is a mistake. I'l wait and see before I "pass sentence" on GW2- but if I have to play with PUGs, and my bad experiences with PUGs dont change that will kill a lot of the games fun for me. (sorry to the people who like to play in groups, and even think the rest of us should be forced to play in groups, but theres a whole list of things that really suck about PUGs that deserves a thread all of it's own) Long story short- giving people options always wins over not giving people options.
Viruzzz
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Originally Posted by Isileth
I have to disagree with your reason against. Its no different than 8 players doing it. Having 7 heroes wouldnt suddenly unlock an ultimate build. Anything that can be done with heroes can be done better (assuming a decent level of player skill) by a player.
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Wait for 8 hours while I sleep, and then be ready to go the SECOND i return!
Loviatar
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Quote:
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people were begging them to improve the henchies from the start so they could dump jerks more easily.
remember way back when they added better henchies like lena to the desert?
people posted how amazing that the hench actually worked.
pug jerks ruined pug and it is literally the heroes keeping it going.
take the heroes away and you have to scrap the henchies as well after doing that
force me to group with the mostly dregs of pugdom and game over for me
pygar
I saw a somebody at Kodash Bazaar the other day spamming "LFG for All's well that ends well" which if I remember right is a cakewalk that barely even requires combat. At any rate, it can be argued that PUGs actually create players that will always /fail at the game. Being good enough to play the game through with Heroes and Henchies should almost be a requirement to join PUGs.
VinnyRidira
If they gave us 7 hero parties, what would happen to the poor henchmen? Would they go on strike for better skills? I think its the flag thing that stops them. They could make the last 4 heroes behave like the henchman for the flagging thing, at least initially till everyone gripes about not having 7 flags buttons.
I h/h or play 2 peeps + 6 often. There are times when I PuG for fun. It is quite shocking how many people don't know how to set up their heroes properly.
I h/h or play 2 peeps + 6 often. There are times when I PuG for fun. It is quite shocking how many people don't know how to set up their heroes properly.
pygar
Quote:
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Originally Posted by VinnyRidira
I h/h or play 2 peeps + 6 often. There are times when I PuG for fun. It is quite shocking how many people don't know how to set up their heroes properly. |
One of the only times I play with other people is sometimes with one of my guild buddies (there are 3 of us in guild,long time friends in RL) and that is me and my friend and 6 Heroes (because when you play with one other person, apparently then it's ok to have more heroes for some reason) Oddly enough having so many heroes does not = win (I mean, sure it does if done right), getting split up from each other is almost as much of a problem as it is in PUGs.