Buffs: Everything nerfed due to PvP balances
Nerfs: Everything buffed due to PvP balances.
PvE skill reversion, what do you want to see?
RiKio
Dr Strangelove
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Originally Posted by Tyla
I believe it allowed 10+ energy skills to be mashed on recharge for the duration on the skill.
Provided extremely strong energy management, just as Mind Blast did, just alot more powerful and straight off. I'm not sure exactly how powerful it was though. I think it was used immensely on flag runners in GvG, so I'm guessing: Pretty powerful. |
The other skills involved have now all been nerfed on account of mysticism, so it really would be fine to bring ether renewal back up.
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Originally Posted by Tyla
They were changed because Monks shouldn't have passive defense that is maintainable on it's own with 1-2 skills I believe. No cast time too!
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So really, they were buffed hugely. I don't see any reason to revert them, since that would just encourage lame stance tanks.
DarkNecrid
So its coming today....
It begins....
It begins....
Nightow
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Originally Posted by DarkNecrid
So its coming today....
It begins.... |
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| By the way, the date for when a few key skills will get separated functionality has not been set. The "arrival date" depends on a number of factors, inlcuding when the designers can get the update to QA and how the QA testing goes |
DarkNecrid
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Originally Posted by Nightow
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I will bet money it comes out today.
Nightow
lol, someone's counting their eggs before they're hatched.
I'll just wait patiently until it happens.
I'll just wait patiently until it happens.
Turtle222
we now might see monks doing something once thought ridiculous by puggers - Smiting
Nightow
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Originally Posted by Turtle222
we now might see monks doing something once thought ridiculous by puggers - Smiting |
Turtle222
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Originally Posted by Nightow
We do... It's called Cathedral of Flames and Shards of Orr.
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Lord Sojar
Ummm, undo armor stacking nerf that was introduced due to Terra Tanks in RA/AB? Yeh, about that....
Splinter Weapon, deadly paradox, MB, Rodgorts, Paragons in general, LoD, Ritualists (especially Ritual Lord!!!), and buff many mesmer skills to make them AoE for PvE use. Thanks.
Splinter Weapon, deadly paradox, MB, Rodgorts, Paragons in general, LoD, Ritualists (especially Ritual Lord!!!), and buff many mesmer skills to make them AoE for PvE use. Thanks.
Tyla
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Originally Posted by Dr Strangelove
They were changed to make them usable in a serious way. A 10 energy 10 second block stance on a 45s recharge by itself is useless since it will rarely be recharged when you need it. A 5 energy 4 second stance on a 15 second recharge allows you to pick and choose what needs to be blocked. They're immensely useful on casters to block physical spikes on demand.
So really, they were buffed hugely. I don't see any reason to revert them, since that would just encourage lame stance tanks. |
la_cabra_de_vida
How About We Put Searing Flames Back To Doing 5784727395 Damage And 10 Energy Too!
makosi
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Originally Posted by la_cabra_de_vida
How About We Put Searing Flames Back To Doing 5784727395 Damage And 10 Energy Too!
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I'm not that bothered what changes are made but it will be an interesting read nonetheless. I'm also keen to know when the patch rolls out as it is usually a Thursday night.
la_cabra_de_vida
The sad part is everyone complains so much here, yet these same people blow through uw/fow/slavers in 45 minutes. So I fail to see how pve has been crippled the way some people here put it.
Shayne Hawke
Ursan nerfed. Assassins buffed. Splinter Weapon goes back to all adjacent. Tactics buffed. Infinite minions.
That would be a good start.
That would be a good start.
dunky_g
Nothing.
The games shagged anyway.
The games shagged anyway.
distilledwill
PvE is fine the way it is. But it would be pretty fun to have some of the stupidly OP skills back. Eg, prenerf Splinter etc.
BlackSephir
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Originally Posted by distilledwill
PvE is fine the way it is. But it would be pretty fun to have some of the stupidly OP skills back. Eg, prenerf Splinter etc.
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I can't believe people want to dumb pve even more.
Chthon
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Originally Posted by Rahja the Thief
Ummm, undo armor stacking nerf that was introduced due to Terra Tanks in RA/AB? Yeh, about that....
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Splinter Weapon, deadly paradox, MB, Rodgorts, Paragons in general, LoD, Ritualists (especially Ritual Lord!!!), and buff many mesmer skills to make them AoE for PvE use. Thanks.[/QUOTE]
Not exactly my priorities, but all things that could stand a revert/buff. (btw: My priority revert = REMOVE SOUL REAPING TIMER, just in case anyone forgot.)
Longasc
I still bet they change a handful of skills as the dev update stated - and do not start by changing game mechanics and whole skill lines.
Crom The Pale
I do belive that [splinter weapon] was nerfed due to PvE farming builds, not anything PvP related so I would be very surprised to see it reverted.
Rangers should get some reversions to skills that were weakened, power shot, Sundering Shot, ect...
Not to mention pets really should leave corpses...that nerf never made any sense at all!
Lastly the class that might need the biggest buff is Elementals, they just don't pack much damage outside of SF. Most all other builds drain energy or leave them with total exhastion so fast they become useless after a casting 3-4 spells.
Rangers should get some reversions to skills that were weakened, power shot, Sundering Shot, ect...
Not to mention pets really should leave corpses...that nerf never made any sense at all!
Lastly the class that might need the biggest buff is Elementals, they just don't pack much damage outside of SF. Most all other builds drain energy or leave them with total exhastion so fast they become useless after a casting 3-4 spells.
DarkNecrid
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| I do belive that was nerfed due to PvE farming builds, not anything PvP related so I would be very surprised to see it reverted. |
Phoenix Tears
I hope Anet will use this also to buff significantly alot of the Skills for Pve, so that they become more powerful and stylish together with soem awesome Skill Synergies they will enable us players then, which will be usable for PvE only, because for Pvp they would be way to overpowered so.
Because i see only a change in UB, when Anet first drastically buffs alot of other Skills for PvE Version to give us plenty new Skill Synergies, whihc should be interesting and powerful enough, to be together better than UB and together with their Synergy alot more interestign to play, than the button smashing of UB.
However, about the Skilsl of this game i absolutely expect nothign anymore of Anet, I've seen so many times, how anet failed at balancing the skills and whenever they tried to balance somethign, they created only new Skill Synergies, which could and were used then for new Builds which were in some certain ways for pvp to overpowered and I don't believe, that with this change of anets balancing now about different skill effect for both modes will be used for much skills. OS I doubt on if, that it will get used to make alot of complety underpowered and uninterstign skills more powerful and so more interestign for builds in PvE to give us players a good alternative over UB, even when i must admit, that I like UB and use it so often as I can, because this skill reduces lots of GW's grind and makes it more endurable.
I personally hope more, that this Split balancing will also fidn from the start on its way into Guild Wars 2, so that GW2 with its new stated Skill System will have for pve really powerful stylish Skills full of action rich gameplay, that you as player feel yourself alot more like playing a real time action-rpg and not like a little child playing with toy soldiers, like GW's battle system looks alike
Because i see only a change in UB, when Anet first drastically buffs alot of other Skills for PvE Version to give us plenty new Skill Synergies, whihc should be interesting and powerful enough, to be together better than UB and together with their Synergy alot more interestign to play, than the button smashing of UB.
However, about the Skilsl of this game i absolutely expect nothign anymore of Anet, I've seen so many times, how anet failed at balancing the skills and whenever they tried to balance somethign, they created only new Skill Synergies, which could and were used then for new Builds which were in some certain ways for pvp to overpowered and I don't believe, that with this change of anets balancing now about different skill effect for both modes will be used for much skills. OS I doubt on if, that it will get used to make alot of complety underpowered and uninterstign skills more powerful and so more interestign for builds in PvE to give us players a good alternative over UB, even when i must admit, that I like UB and use it so often as I can, because this skill reduces lots of GW's grind and makes it more endurable.
I personally hope more, that this Split balancing will also fidn from the start on its way into Guild Wars 2, so that GW2 with its new stated Skill System will have for pve really powerful stylish Skills full of action rich gameplay, that you as player feel yourself alot more like playing a real time action-rpg and not like a little child playing with toy soldiers, like GW's battle system looks alike
DarkGanni
Not sure if someone mentioned it yet but I would like to see the armor cap removed from PvE, if i'm not mistake the reason why it exists is because of the terras in PvP.
As for Skill I'd like to see Watch Yourself back to the old way, LoD reverted back to 5sec recharge and decent heal. Can't think of anything else.
Oh and a nerf to ursan for the sake of build creativity again.
- Ganni
As for Skill I'd like to see Watch Yourself back to the old way, LoD reverted back to 5sec recharge and decent heal. Can't think of anything else.
Oh and a nerf to ursan for the sake of build creativity again.
- Ganni
The Meth
Splinter Weapon is still overpowered. Seriously, stop complaining that your damage is capped at 420 bonus damage at 8 spec and 705 bonus damage at 14 spec. Thats still more then any other spell in the game, and you are only capped in a very limited amount of instances.
Ritualists need some of the _OTHER_ channeling skills buffed so the line isn't 5% game-breakingly powerful and the other 95% dogshit. Same for communing and spawning, except that they are 100% useless atm.
Agreed on watch yourself revert, tactics is hugely underpowered right now.
Agreed on removing armor stacking cap for PvE, its one of those things that just seems irrational and that a new player would never be able to figure out without reading the update the day it was done. If I remember correctly it was imposed because of Stand Your Ground + Watch Yourself giving all of your casters 100 base armor, not because of lame terra tanks that nobody cared about in RA
Ritualists need some of the _OTHER_ channeling skills buffed so the line isn't 5% game-breakingly powerful and the other 95% dogshit. Same for communing and spawning, except that they are 100% useless atm.
Agreed on watch yourself revert, tactics is hugely underpowered right now.
Agreed on removing armor stacking cap for PvE, its one of those things that just seems irrational and that a new player would never be able to figure out without reading the update the day it was done. If I remember correctly it was imposed because of Stand Your Ground + Watch Yourself giving all of your casters 100 base armor, not because of lame terra tanks that nobody cared about in RA
Nightow
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Originally Posted by The Meth
Splinter Weapon is still overpowered. Seriously, stop complaining that your damage is capped at 420 bonus damage at 8 spec and 705 bonus damage at 14 spec. Thats still more then any other spell in the game, and you are only capped in a very limited amount of instances.
Ritualists need some of the _OTHER_ channeling skills buffed so the line isn't 5% game-breakingly powerful and the other 95% dogshit. Same for communing and spawning, except that they are 100% useless atm. |
[Caretaker's Charge] Increase energy gained.
[Destructive Was Glaive] Increase duration, match recharge accordingly.
[Channeled Strike]+[Gaze from Beyond]+[Spirit Boon Strike] Decrease casting time.
[Lamentation] Give it conditional recharge like [Signet of Sorrow]
[Weapon of Aggression] Lower energy cost.
[Warmonger's Weapon] Decrease recharge time slightly.
Alex the Great
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Originally Posted by Nightow
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if anything, they need to revert [mind blast] and [rodgorts invocation] because fire now sucks compared to how it used to be, and everyone is stuck playing with [assassin's promise]
Nightow
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Originally Posted by Alex the Great
things don't get nefed do do over-use, things get nerfed when they are an over-powered problem. And WTF? nerf healing?
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Red bars go down.
Red bars go up.
Red bars go down.
Red bars go up.
/yawn boring!
Also, anything overused or overdone can easily become boring. Who in the world wants that!?
One more thing, a nerf to [Healers Boon] would affect Ursan parties, right?
The Meth
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Originally Posted by Nightow
Protection prayers from my understanding promotes active defense which is praised by most folk. All healing does is the following:
Red bars go down. Red bars go up. Red bars go down. Red bars go up. /yawn boring! Also, anything overused or overdone can easily become boring. Who in the world wants that!? |
Active protection is the kind of protection that takes skill and shows off good monking ability. It is using single-target protections in anticipation of enemy damage to greatly lower damage taken.
Passive protection is party wide defenses that are just kept up 24/7. No real skill involved.
Right now 99% of PvE protection is passive protection. The reason being that it is impossible for a monk to protect against Every Single Monster because they are all doing 100+ damage auto attacks and 200+ damage spells. As long as they keep doing this active protection is barely a footnote compared to passive protection. Reducing healing isn't going to affect that much.
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Originally Posted by Nightow
One more thing, a nerf to [Healers Boon] would affect Ursan parties, right?
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Agreed on your rit buffs btw.
Nightow
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Originally Posted by Alex the Great
everyone is stuck playing with [assassin's promise]
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Then [air of superiority] FTW!
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Originally Posted by The Meth
There are two kinds of protection: active and passive
Active protection is the kind of protection that takes skill and shows off good monking ability. It is using single-target protections in anticipation of enemy damage to greatly lower damage taken. Passive protection is party wide defenses that are just kept up 24/7. No real skill involved. Right now 99% of PvE protection is passive protection. The reason being that it is impossible for a monk to protect against Every Single Monster because they are all doing 100+ damage auto attacks and 200+ damage spells. As long as they keep doing this active protection is barely a footnote compared to passive protection. Reducing healing isn't going to affect that much. |
Ok, thank you for sharing your insight on protection prayers.
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| Want to know the real secret to nerfing ursan parties? Nerfing Ursan. |
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| Agreed on your rit buffs btw. |
DarkNecrid
Told you guys it wasn't going live today...jeez....
Nightow
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Originally Posted by DarkNecrid
Told you guys it wasn't going live today...jeez....
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121212
darkknightkain
What I'd like to see is to have all the pvp-oriented nerfs/buffs reverted, so all skills can go back to function the way they were intented to function in the game.
As long as the normal skills are back to normal then don't need to worry about those "powered-by-grind" pve skills (whose sole purpose was to make up the skills that got messed around too much by pvp) anymore.
As long as the normal skills are back to normal then don't need to worry about those "powered-by-grind" pve skills (whose sole purpose was to make up the skills that got messed around too much by pvp) anymore.
Chthon
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Originally Posted by Crom The Pale
I do belive that [splinter weapon] was nerfed due to PvE farming builds, not anything PvP related so I would be very surprised to see it reverted.
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Originally Posted by DarkNecrid
Blew stuff at VoD faster than a hooker with 20 years of experience under her belt.
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Originally Posted by Nightow
One more thing, a nerf to [Healers Boon] would affect Ursan parties, right?
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This is important, so please pay attention: That is precisely that kind of thinking that made GW balance the mess it is now. Indirect nerfs are BAD. If there's a problem with something being too strong, you have to directly address the problem by nerfing the skill/mechanic at the heart of the problem. Nerfing the "on-the-side" skills that help with an imbalanced build rarely succeeds in killing the problem build (SR timer nerf didn't fix spirit spam; orders nerf didn't fix IWAY; etc.), and it almost always causes collateral damage that ruins builds that were never imbalanced (PvE builds historically). If Ursan needs nerfing, there is one and only one right way to do it: nerf Ursan Blessing directly.
Nightow
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Originally Posted by Chthon
STOP. RIGHT. THERE.
Yadda, yadda, yadda.... |
lol, I'll just admit that I had an ulterior motive. Namely, to make restoration look better.
Heh, someone tell Chthon to switch to decaf please.
Also, ...
BlackSephir
They can revert pve Fox's Promise. Blew stuff in pvp but it was so fun running around, swinging your unblockable scythe in pve ;d
Crom The Pale
Just how far do we really want this to go?
Should we revert [Sand Shards] so sins have another insane damage skill?
These reversions need to be very carefully looked at or all we will be doing is creating several profession specific UB builds. ie one build for each class that so totaly owns all other builds that its the only one players will use.
Despite what most PvP players think PvE does need balance, just a different type of balance. We need each class to have internal balance so that multiple builds can all work equally effectively. ie Water Elemental = Fire elemental = Earth elemental = Air elemental, not necasarily equal in damage but in the ability to use each of those elements without gimping your effectiveness to the party.
Should we revert [Sand Shards] so sins have another insane damage skill?
These reversions need to be very carefully looked at or all we will be doing is creating several profession specific UB builds. ie one build for each class that so totaly owns all other builds that its the only one players will use.
Despite what most PvP players think PvE does need balance, just a different type of balance. We need each class to have internal balance so that multiple builds can all work equally effectively. ie Water Elemental = Fire elemental = Earth elemental = Air elemental, not necasarily equal in damage but in the ability to use each of those elements without gimping your effectiveness to the party.
Frank Dudenstein
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Originally Posted by Crom The Pale
Despite what most PvP players think PvE does need balance, just a different type of balance. We need each class to have internal balance so that multiple builds can all work equally effectively. ie Water Elemental = Fire elemental = Earth elemental = Air elemental, not necasarily equal in damage but in the ability to use each of those elements without gimping your effectiveness to the party.
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1. Go to any of the 1000 threads about nerfing Ursan. For every single thoughtful post about maintaining PvE balance and challenge, there are numerous posts of "Don't touch teh bear!" or "I want things to be fast and easy" or even worse "You don't understand Ursan DOES take skill to play"
2. Go to any post-update thread involving a nerf that was CLEARLY overpowered in PvE (soul reaping, 10 minions, splinter weapon, the list is endless). Even if done for PvP reasons .. those nerfs were entirely appropriate for PvE, yet the community backlash was like a tsunami of crying. Anet really can't ignore that.
Conclusion: Despite the vocal minorty that wants PvE balance, there is an even MORE vocal majority that wants Hard Mode to be Easy Mode and Normal mode to be Godmode. Anet's hands are tied ... they have to give the majority what it wants or risk losing them in GW2.
Nightmares Hammer
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Originally Posted by Frank Dudenstein
PvE DOES need balance ... unfortunately 80% (or more) of the community DOES NOT WANT IT. Want proof?
1. Go to any of the 1000 threads about nerfing Ursan. For every single thoughtful post about maintaining PvE balance and challenge, there are numerous posts of "Don't touch teh bear!" or "I want things to be fast and easy" or even worse "You don't understand Ursan DOES take skill to play" 2. Go to any post-update thread involving a nerf that was CLEARLY overpowered in PvE (soul reaping, 10 minions, splinter weapon, the list is endless). Even if done for PvP reasons .. those nerfs were entirely appropriate for PvE, yet the community backlash was like a tsunami of crying. Anet really can't ignore that. Conclusion: Despite the vocal minorty that wants PvE balance, there is an even MORE vocal majority that wants Hard Mode to be Easy Mode and Normal mode to be Godmode. Anet's hands are tied ... they have to give the majority what it wants or risk losing them in GW2. |
Hyper Cutter
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Originally Posted by Chthon
Nope. It was nerfed because it absolutely mauled NPCs in GvG.
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