Was termination really appropriate? - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

ZainAhmed

Academy Page

Join Date: Nov 2005

Earth

I need a guild

R/Mo

28 May 2010 at 16:30 - 281

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerel

The EULA also outlines the terms of service does it not? There is no issue of that being questionable, whats more the 'legality' of EULA in Europe only gets questioned when the purchaser didn't have the opportunity to read said EULA before making the purchase...

Did you ask to see a copy of the EULA before you bought Guild Wars? Here's a hint for you, it was available on the Guild Wars website... that is to say, you can't argue that they forced the agreement on you.

You had every opportunity to read it, and more importantly you had an OBLIGATION to do so.

Again, you didn't have to buy their product... nobody forced you to buy it, nobody put a gun to your head and demanded that you agree to the EULA. More importantly, that rather standard (though crappy) portion of the EULA has ABSOLUTELY NO BEARING on the issue of banned botters.

NCsoft is the judge,jury and executioner, if I'm not mistaken or at least so it seems. And on the issue of rules enforcement in their game, on their servers... who are you suggesting would be better placed to do such?

As for providing proof, they very well should provide evidence of your banned behavior where applicable IF YOU REQUEST IT, in the same way that they'll review their handling of your banning IF YOU REQUEST IT.

Oh, I see... you committed a virtual crime, in a virtual world to obtain virtual money? And the NCsoft response was to throw your virtual ass in the virtual pokey (slang for jail or prison).

Here's the thing, a full account costs $20-30 often enough now days, Guild Wars is pretty cheap if you want to look at the actual replacement cost of the account... tell me just how cheap do you think it is for NCsoft to actually have to deal with bots, cheats, scammers and scumbags? How cheap do you think it is for their support staff to have to review all those banned accounts that are demanding that they did nothing wrong?

Yeah, that's RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing right... it costs them REAL RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOING MONEY, your virtual crime isn't so 'virtual' anymore is it?

I guess I should have lived up to your expectations of being hateful... but the truth should serve well enough to illustrate how clueless you're being on the issue.

No actual botters are here on the forums afaik, they all went and bought a new account and maybe are, right as i'm posting here, making money again. Who is on the forums QQing? Stupid, foolish, curious or probably innocent people who are waiting for lift on ban...but I am starting to believe that these bans are very profitable for Anet/NCsoft no matter what the cost for catching and "dealing" with bots or whatever shit you said...

Laraja

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Dec 2007

Somewhere over the rainbow

Descendents of Honor

Rt/

28 May 2010 at 16:31 - 282

No sympathy here for people who knew botting could get them banned, but did it anyway. You were playing Russian roulette and finally spun the chamber with the bullet. There is no one else to blame but yourself, so man or woman up and accept reponsibility for breaking the rules.

cormac ap dunn

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2007

Mystic Empires III [xMEx]

Me/

28 May 2010 at 16:36 - 283

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZainAhmed

Ijeez it's like you slip and fall and now your RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing evil but you never meant to slip but no one give a shit, it just happened.

a slip is when you do it by accident, to download a botting program is not an "OOPS i accidentally downloaded and used this bot i had to set up meticulously" bit of an invalid point there, you had to knowingly and willingly do this. and as far as the degrees the murder analogy though highly inappropriate makes a point killing is killing you can do it a little or alot but the crime is still called murder. you can bot a little or alot, but its all still botting. Cheater gets the slap on the wrist, he cheats again, but if all the cheaters are wiped out publicly then guess who is tempted to bot? not any who hear about what happened to the last bunch of botters! sorry these folks are an example, but its an example that works.

snaek

Forge Runner

Join Date: Mar 2006

N/

28 May 2010 at 16:38 - 284

^no, a slip is when you make a bad judgement call (for whatever reason), and regret it afterwards.

ZainAhmed

Academy Page

Join Date: Nov 2005

Earth

I need a guild

R/Mo

28 May 2010 at 16:39 - 285

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falynn Firestorm

No sympathy here for people who knew botting could get them banned, but did it anyway. You were playing Russian roulette and finally spun the chamber with the bullet. There is no one else to blame but yourself, so man or woman up and accept reponsibility for breaking the rules.

Yea there are stills bots out there...and many more coming soon.

I didn't realize it the instant I injected that stupid dll to GW that I'm doing something terribly wrong and I will get banned...of course you wouldn't... but after 6-7 times of dshotting patient spirit I said RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO this I'm not getting banned for this...look where loyalty to fair playing got me...
the punishment is too harsh...

cormac ap dunn

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2007

Mystic Empires III [xMEx]

Me/

28 May 2010 at 16:40 - 286

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZainAhmed

but I am starting to believe that these bans are very profitable for Anet/NCsoft no matter what the cost for catching and "dealing" with bots or whatever shit you said...

I for one would be happy if those banned went out, purchased a new game (IP bans are a B*tch) and provide a little extra capitol for GW2. if they slip through, guess what will likely happen if they bot again? yup, ban. and weeeee more entertainment for those that abide the rules.

Zarion Silverarrow

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2008

Puerto Rico

The Annunaki Interventionists

P/W

28 May 2010 at 16:42 - 287

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falynn Firestorm

No sympathy here for people who knew botting could get them banned, but did it anyway. You were playing Russian roulette and finally spun the chamber with the bullet. There is no one else to blame but yourself, so man or woman up and accept reponsibility for breaking the rules.

No need to get your post count up by posting what almost every person that agrees with all bans 100% is saying...

We get it,we got banned because EULA said so.Stop repeating it,it ain't necessary since we understand it.

Make up your own opinion.

If you want to keep posting it,then whatever,but keep in mind your post won't have more effect than the one before similar to yours (with the exeption if someone didn't fully read it or your explaining yourself,etc) but since your post has been posted several times,no need.

The real discussion here is;

Does a first-timer-little-time-boting-took-back-the-action-before-the-bans...er deserve the same punishment as a repeat offender-24/7 boter-gained IRL $$-gained many titles-gained in game money-didn't-feel-"sorry"-until-bans..er?

Answering that with a yes or no is plain ignorant and lazy IMO

Riot Narita

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Apr 2007

28 May 2010 at 16:45 - 288

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZainAhmed

if someone just tried out stupidity, out of curiousity, out of temptation etc etc ... give them the approriate time...

No. You get caught cheating, you get banned. It's that simple. Everyone knows it. No need to measure how bad your cheating was, and come up with a menu of different punishments to suit.

In any case how would A-Net implement that?

Let people bot, until it reaches some limit at which point they give you ban? In other words condone botting, as long as its "not too much".

What limit should they set for how much you can bot or cheat? How would they track how close people are to that limit? Why should they spend time and resources on that?

I don't want them to waste time and effort on that, and why should I (or any player who doesn't cheat)? That's time and effort that would be better spent on GW1, GW2 and support of regular (non-cheating) players. Cheats don't deserve sympathy, never mind actual resources.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZainAhmed

jeez it's like you slip and fall and now your RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing evil but you never meant to slip but no one give a shit, it just happened.

No.

Nobody bots by accident. They know its cheating. They know the possible consequences. If they get banned, it should come as no surprise. It should also come as no surprise when people don't "give a shit".

Zarion Silverarrow

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2008

Puerto Rico

The Annunaki Interventionists

P/W

28 May 2010 at 16:47 - 289

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot Narita

No. You get caught cheating, you get banned. It's that simple. Everyone knows it. No need to meaure how bad your cheating was, and come up with a menu of different punishments to suit.

In any case how would A-Net implement that?

Let people bot, until it reaches some limit at which point they give you ban? In other words condone botting, as long as its "not too much".

What limit should they set for how much you can bot or cheat? How would they track how close people are to that limit? Why should they spend time and resources on that?

I don't want them to waste time and effort on that, and why should I (or any player who doesn't cheat)? That's time and effort that would be better spent on GW1, GW2 and support of regular (non-cheating) players. Cheats don't deserve sympathy, never mind actual resources.

No.

Nobody bots by accident. They know its cheating. They know the possible consequences. If they get banned, it should come as no surprise. It should also come as no surprise when people don't "give a shit".

Is it that hard to think this:

Ban a first timer,little time botting person for 2 weeks,he does it again,perma ban.

Everyones thinking;either perma ban,or alot of 2 week bans...just mix em up,it ain't that hard to have an idea yourself.

PS: On the article that appears on your loggin-page,click it

!!!!! it actually says they got new staff for bots,so no resources would be lost...just people doing their work.

cormac ap dunn

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2007

Mystic Empires III [xMEx]

Me/

28 May 2010 at 16:48 - 290

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZainAhmed

Yea there are stills bots out there...and many more coming soon.

I didn't realize it the instant I injected that stupid dll to GW that I'm doing something terribly wrong and I will get banned...of course you wouldn't... but after 6-7 times of dshotting patient spirit I said RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO this I'm not getting banned for this..
:

you did realize botting was wrong... of course you would... as soon as you used it you realized the possibility to get banned was pretty real

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZainAhmed

look where loyalty to fair playing got me...
the punishment is too harsh...

and this... THIS is funny, using a bot was fair play? breaking the rules was loyalty? you really have a loose grip on these concepts! the ban for you is probably best, hate to be on a team where you go charging in saying HIT OUR MONK HE'S RIGHT HERE!

Kharmin

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2009

Far Shiverpeaks

Clan Quarren [QRRN]

R/

28 May 2010 at 16:50 - 291

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

Is it that hard to think this:

Ban a first timer,little time botting person for 2 weeks,he does it again,perma ban.

Everyones thinking;either perma ban,or alot of 2 week bans...just mix em up,it ain't that hard to have an idea yourself.

What's to determine a "first timer?" Duration of use? Amount of swag obtained? Level of cheating? There are just too many variables for the Company to maintain/monitor on a case-by-case basis. It is easier to disallow bots via EULA and then enforce it via ban.

Zarion Silverarrow

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2008

Puerto Rico

The Annunaki Interventionists

P/W

28 May 2010 at 16:57 - 292

Quote:

Originally Posted by cormac ap dunn

THIS coming from you? you have repeated your whiney plea to the community a hundred times, and you think that statement is repetative?
you need to accept that the vast majority of people see your ban as appropriate, not dismiss it because you don't like the answers or keep asking till someone sees it your way.

Yea,quote that part only from my post...read the rest.

I said I wasn't going to reply back to you,but anyways...

Here it is in summary for you:

Don't repeat what OTHERS say unless you want to CHANGE it in some way.

Don't keep repeating what YOU said unless people are not understanding you or you want to say it in other words.

The point;if your gona post something,post your opinion,not what everyone else has been posting since the beggining.

Another Felldspar

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Sep 2006

Alchemy Incorporated

Mo/E

28 May 2010 at 17:00 - 293

Unfortunately, it is an appropriate punishment to permanently ban accounts for botting. I don't enjoy seeing the fall-out, I'm not going to make fun of the people that have lost their accounts, I know that some people did indeed fill up their HoM before starting to bot, and for those I feel a true sympathy.

But, that doesn't make the botting okay. Botting affects the game world, and thereby the other players in that game world. Stopping it must be done. Perma Bans are the only punishment that reflects the seriousness of the gaming offense. This is the most odious of all of the infractions that could take place. It deserves the strongest punishment, mainly so that anyone that cares about their account will decide against using a bot in the future. Even for a minute or just a chest or two.

Offensive names deserve their 3-day time out. Bots, dupes, hacks deserve permanent banning. It's appropriate.

cormac ap dunn

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2007

Mystic Empires III [xMEx]

Me/

28 May 2010 at 17:01 - 294

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZainAhmed

those aren't accident people actually intended to commit such a crime and had no idea what they were doing AND should obviously be sent to jail for life like a perma ban. see how that feels?

you intended to bot, end of story, you intentionally did what you did, semantics will not excuse that you chose everything that you did, no one forced you, no one made you do it. now you sit cold and lonely on the outside of the game, all your achievements all your work lost for a choice!, people with no choice? they deserve lenience. people who knew the risks and chose the wrong path? they got what they knew would come. in the end you can take what happens and make yourself a better gamer, or you can choose to kick and scream and muff your ears and ignore your choices and move to the next cheat in the next game. either way, you were banned as were every one else who botted, justly, by anet, who had observed your bad decision, and made the call that is their right to make.

Nerel

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jun 2008

Australia, what you want my home address?

[CAT]

Mo/

28 May 2010 at 17:01 - 295

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZainAhmed

Yea there are stills bots out there...and many more coming soon.

I didn't realize it the instant I injected that stupid dll to GW that I'm doing something terribly wrong and I will get banned...of course you wouldn't... but after 6-7 times of dshotting patient spirit I said RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO this I'm not getting banned for this...look where loyalty to fair playing got me...
the punishment is too harsh...

You didn't read about what the bot actually did before you downloaded and used it? You had to have a clue that it would give you an unfair advantage in PvP, right?
If the answer is 'Yes' then yes, you did realize that you were doing something terribly wrong.

I understand what you're mean when you say that you saw how effective the bot was and decided not to use it, that is almost a commendable decision... but loyalty? No, the loyal players are the ones that knew better than to ever touch a bot. Sorry.

Have you been in contact with NCsoft support? If you honestly only used the bot long enough to d-shot half a dozen times they very well might overturn your permanent ban or reduce it to something less severe.

Sir Cusfreak

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Nov 2007

In your backline

No Tags [NONE]

28 May 2010 at 17:06 - 296

Quote:

There is always an appropriate punishment for every crime...maybe not 100% true but that's how the system is supposed to work...so saying that killing is killing whether you do it a little or alot and all botters should get perma ban...idts

The perma ban IS by all means an approriate punishment. theres no 'killing' analogy needed. YES, ALL botters should be banned. Period. No execptions, no 'I only botted for this', or for that, or for drinking in a GH, or anything. End of story. Youre guilty of botting, it wasn't an accident. I don't think theres any part of this that's hard to understand. Say it with me: "HAPPY DHUUMSDAY!" now say it again: "HAPPY DHUUMSDAY" and repeat that until you can REALLY FEEL
it. It's over, you're done, it's right and correct and good for the rest of us. move on.

cormac ap dunn

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2007

Mystic Empires III [xMEx]

Me/

28 May 2010 at 17:07 - 297

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerel

You didn't read about what the bot actually did before you downloaded and used it? You had to have a clue that it would give you an unfair advantage in PvP, right?
If the answer is 'Yes' then yes, you did realize that you were doing something terribly wrong.

I understand what you're mean when you say that you saw how effective the bot was and decided not to use it, that is almost a commendable decision... but loyalty? No, the loyal players are the ones that knew better than to ever touch a bot. Sorry.

Have you been in contact with NCsoft support? If you honestly only used the bot long enough to d-shot half a dozen times they very well might overturn your permanent ban or reduce it to something less severe.

i think to back out on this issue due to the amout of cheating would send the message to all cheaters that there is a degree of cheating that is acceptable, he said it himself, there will be new bots, that are less detectable, know what that means? new excuses to push the cheat, and who is inclined to do that most? those that already cheat.

maddigit

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Apr 2009

United States

W/

28 May 2010 at 17:08 - 298

Let's say they ban for two weeks a first time botter. Right there it's telling EVERYONE to go ahead and use bots/cheat once, try to fool us, you get caught you get 2 week ban. Hell then EVERYONE will take their 1 shot at botting see how long they get away with it until they get their simple 2 week ban.

So people would use bots/cheat if that was the case knowing they'd be back in two weeks. It just doesn't work.

It's a bummer you all lost your time/money/items, but we all know the rules.

Get another account, start over if you don't have an IP ban in effect too.

And follow the EULA.

Phaern Majes

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Sep 2005

Anywhere but up

The Panserbjorne [ROAR]

R/Mo

28 May 2010 at 17:13 - 299

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZainAhmed

It was an accident in my mind.

So, when you deliberately (that's the key word here) went out and found a site to download a bot from - that was an accident? You MADE a choice to bot, not just accidentally started using one. So your analogies to accidental murders is irrelevant; you made a choice to bot. Being ignorant of possible consequences does not excuse you from responsibility. If you kill someone and didn't know that it was illegal, you'll still go to prison. Sure accidents are another case, but your botting was no accident.

If you want to play again, go buy another account. Play it for 6 months or so without the use of bots and then petition ANet to get your account back. Prove you can play fairly and maybe then I'd be sympathetic to your original account possibly getting paroled.

But lets face it most people who are banned are just going to say "Screw it, I'm not paying to have to start over." And these same people are likely to not buy GW2 anymore because they won't get their HoM and may harbor bad feelings towards ANet for getting banned.

But look at this from the unbanned communities perspective. A ton of botters have been kicked out of the game for good. All those people who caused us years of grief in pvp, have botted endlessly to farm, and to obtain titles, they are all now gone from the game. How is that a bad thing for those of us who support fair game play? And now those same people won't be joining GW2? Sounds like a win/win to me.

QQ away, you got caught. Doesn't matter if you only did it once or you did it for years. You did it deliberately and reaped your just rewards, gratz.

Rocky Raccoon

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2007

Massachusetts, USA

Guardians of the Cosmos

R/Mo

28 May 2010 at 17:16 - 300

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

The real discussion here is;

Does a first-timer-little-time-boting-took-back-the-action-before-the-bans...er deserve the same punishment as a repeat offender-24/7 boter-gained IRL $$-gained many titles-gained in game money-didn't-feel-"sorry"-until-bans..er?

Answering that with a yes or no is plain ignorant and lazy IMO

Did you accidentally download the bot? No, you didn't. You had to make a concerted effort to use the bot for whatever reason. The rules state that is not allowed (no disclaimer for degree of use anywhere). You deserve the account cancellation.

Zarion Silverarrow

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2008

Puerto Rico

The Annunaki Interventionists

P/W

28 May 2010 at 17:16 - 301

Quote:

Originally Posted by maddigit

Let's say they ban for two weeks a first time botter. Right there it's telling EVERYONE to go ahead and use bots/cheat once, try to fool us, you get caught you get 2 week ban. Hell then EVERYONE will take their 1 shot at botting see how long they get away with it until they get their simple 2 week ban.

So people would use bots/cheat if that was the case knowing they'd be back in two weeks. It just doesn't work.

It's a bummer you all lost your time/money/items, but we all know the rules.

Get another account, start over if you don't have an IP ban in effect too.

And follow the EULA.

Once again,I repeat myself...

2 week ban for first timer,perma ban if he/she does it again.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rocky Raccoon

Did you accidentally download the bot? No, you didn't. You had to make a concerted effort to use the bot for whatever reason. The rules state that is not allowed (no disclaimer for degree of use anywhere). You deserve the account cancellation.

You don't get what I'm saying.

I KNOW MY BAN WAS ALRIGHT IN TERMS OF THE EULA!

BUT,it should be changed. I don't think I deserve a ban for walking around in a town with a bot for 10 seconds....the only advantage I had was not pressing R and moving the camera around

Kharmin

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2009

Far Shiverpeaks

Clan Quarren [QRRN]

R/

28 May 2010 at 17:20 - 302

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

Once again,I repeat myself...

2 week ban for first timer,perma ban if he/she does it again.

So everyone should d/l all of the available bots, run them until they get caught, and then sit out a two week ban after which they can enjoy the fruits of their illegally obtained rewards?

Kydd

Academy Page

Join Date: Oct 2006

[eyes]

28 May 2010 at 17:26 - 303

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

Is it that hard to think this:

Ban a first timer,little time botting person for 2 weeks,he does it again,perma ban.

Everyones thinking;either perma ban,or alot of 2 week bans...just mix em up,it ain't that hard to have an idea yourself.

PS: On the article that appears on your loggin-page,click it

!!!!! it actually says they got new staff for bots,so no resources would be lost...just people doing their work.

I'd like to think that staff is trying to catch bots not moniter the people they already caught. Why should people have to specifically watch your account in case you get curious and dont change your mind next time?

@ the people who say the community is being too harsh on botters its because botters have been ruining the game for people who don't bot. And yes you did detract from my experience by botting so I don't feel bad seeing you go.

StormX

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Nov 2005

E/Mo

28 May 2010 at 17:29 - 304

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZainAhmed

If someone uses bots on a daily basis and just won't quit..then BAM perma ban his ass...but if someone just tried out stupidity, out of curiousity, out of temptation etc etc ... give them the approriate time...jeez it's like you slip and fall and now your RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing evil but you never meant to slip but no one give a shit, it just happened.

Consider it a life lesson learned? Luckily for you it was in a relatively harmless virtual situation and not in real life. Fact: life is not fair. You do stupid shit, you face the consequences, whether deserved or not, many times you can't do anything except man up and take it head on. Try telling the cops... "but sir, all i did was try one" If you slip and fall, you should get up, learn to be more careful and be the wiser for it. THAT is all you can do.

I'm not gonna join in the stone throwing here but the ecto stack hoarders and pvp botters can eat dirt and go to hell

Zarion Silverarrow

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2008

Puerto Rico

The Annunaki Interventionists

P/W

28 May 2010 at 17:31 - 305

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kharmin

So everyone should d/l all of the available bots, run them until they get caught, and then sit out a two week ban after which they can enjoy the fruits of their illegally obtained rewards?

Nice point there... I guess the 2 week ban should include loss of items/gold/titles points gained in the last X months or something....its a problem though,because you wouldn't know how long the person has been botting (i think)...maybe keep the account without items/tittles/etc...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kydd

I'd like to think that staff is trying to catch bots not moniter the people they already caught. Why should people have to specifically watch your account in case you get curious and dont change your mind next time?

@ the people who say the community is being too harsh on botters its because botters have been ruining the game for people who don't bot. And yes you did detract from my experience by botting so I don't feel bad seeing you go.

I didn't ruin your gaming experience...tell me how walking 20ish steps on remains of salahalajalajla affects you. That is all I did and I was banned.

cormac ap dunn

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2007

Mystic Empires III [xMEx]

Me/

28 May 2010 at 17:31 - 306

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

I KNOW MY BAN WAS ALRIGHT IN TERMS OF THE EULA!

there you go

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

BUT,it should be changed. I don't think I deserve a ban for walking around in a town with a bot for 10 seconds....the only advantage I had was not pressing R and moving the camera around

you ruined it

you USED A BOT

you got banned. its over. maybe you should start wishing for a pot of gold too, oooh or a pony, a flying pony! you might get your account back at the same time....

Riot Narita

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Apr 2007

28 May 2010 at 17:31 - 307

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

BUT,it should be changed. I don't think I deserve a ban for walking around in a town with a bot for 10 seconds....the only advantage I had was not pressing R and moving the camera around

So you say. And we can trust the word of a person who was banned for cheating/botting. Yeah right. /sarcasm

You got banned. You know why. You knew the rules. You knew the consequences if you got caught. You accepted that risk.

But now you got caught. And instead of accepting the consequences of your own actions, the risk you took... you want the rules to be changed. So that you can be unbanned.

Aint gonna happen. Move on.

Charlie Dayman

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Apr 2009

Trifecta Luminati [TRI]

W/

28 May 2010 at 17:35 - 308

There was a post in this thread that I was going to quote, but it suddenly disappeared. Anyways, botting is a serious problem that creates huge issues with games. If you're just going to give someone a slap on the wrist for their first time offense, chances are most other people are also going to take a stab at botting since the return in rewards can be phenomenal. That's encouraging people to use this first offense as an excuse to see how far they can go without being caught. Also, it gives people more opportunity to test out better bots that are harder to detect and catch.

So in short: if you bot at any point in time, a permaban is an appropriate punishment.

Mangione

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: May 2007

28 May 2010 at 17:36 - 309

Yes. Termination was (and IS) appropriate.
You bot. You lose.

Want a new account? Go buy another one.

The "I didn't know excuse" is so much /fail, I don't even know where to start.
If you are setting up a bot, you know the game well enough to know that bots are forbidden.

Quote:

Originally Posted by belshazaarswrath

Bragging about banning a shitload of people and doing it in an extravagant fashion such as this is clearly a show for the masses and it appeases their need to watch people get shitted on while using their crimes as justification. They could have done this quickly and quietly but they chose not to. And people are getting warm fuzzy's about it.

Sure they broke the rules. Sure they got caught. Why don't you punish them the same way you have everyone else before? I mean seriously the makers of this game are SHOWING OFF that 3,700 of their players thought the game was too much of a pain in the ass to play.

Think of the botters who enjoyed winning in PvP venues against non-botters and rubbing in the face of honest players their cheats.
They were, oh, so elite. They mocked the players who did not bot, the ones who followed the rules. Defeated and insulted.

Same in PvE: a player doing all his grind sees his accomplishments devalued by "oh-hum... yes, I got that just by afk-ing a couple of weeks. In your face, you needed a month of grinding."(I don't like grind, and so I stay away from grindy titles and stuff. It's different from those who don't like grind, but decide to bot to get the reward anyway.)

Anet gave the "showing off" as compensation for all the mockery that came from the botting crowd.

Don't cry that people are reveling in others misfortune.
Those "others", those botters, are not innocent victims who are "getting shitted" (as you wrote), they have been ruining the game experience of honest players.
The punishment is appropriate: they ruin the game, they are kicked out of the game.
No need for car/prison/homicide/deathpenalty analogies or any other legal bullshit.

Happy DhuumsDay.
Well done, ArenaNet.

Kydd

Academy Page

Join Date: Oct 2006

[eyes]

28 May 2010 at 17:37 - 310

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

Nice point there... I guess the 2 week ban should include loss of items/gold/titles points gained in the last X months or something....its a problem though,because you wouldn't know how long the person has been botting (i think)...maybe keep the account without items/tittles/etc...

I didn't ruin your gaming experience...tell me how walking 20ish steps on remains of salahalajalajla affects you. That is all I did and I was banned.

You ruined by downloading a bot. More people wanting to download a bot makes more people create bots.
Edit:
Also because of you anet hast to spend time looking at your support ticket that could be spent improving the game. According to you they should also have to baby sit your account instead of improving the game. These missed improvements are detracting from my experiance.

Firebaall

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Sep 2006

28 May 2010 at 17:38 - 311

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

Once again,I repeat myself...

2 week ban for first timer,perma ban if he/she does it again.

All botters deserve the perm ban. Anything less would invite people like you to try out or test bots assuming they have one "free pass". A free pass that could be used to find a bot or program that isn't so easy to detect.

Goodbye, don't come back.

Lord Sojar

The Fallen One

Join Date: Dec 2005

Oblivion

Irrelevant

Mo/Me

28 May 2010 at 17:40 - 312

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mangione

Yes. Termination was (and IS) appropriate.
You bot. You lose.

Want a new account? Go buy another one.

The "I didn't know excuse" is so much /fail, I don't even know where to start.
If you are setting up a bot, you know the game well enough to know that bots are forbidden.

*snip*

Don't cry that people are reveling in others misfortune.
Those "others", those botters, are not innocent victims who are "getting shitted" (as you wrote), they have been ruining the game experience of honest players.
The punishment is appropriate: they ruin the game, they are kicked out of the game.
No need for car analogies, homicide analogies, or legal bullshit.

Happy DhuumsDay.
Well done, ArenaNet.

Bingo. Botters don't deserve to play the game. Personally, I wouldn't welcome them back with new accounts, I'd MAC and IP ban them. But... alas, I don't run ANET. Those same botters may get new accounts, and find those better, harder to detect bots... and when they do, I hope ANET sees that the same people will continue to cheat, because they are cheaters. Hopefully, then, they will be unwelcome to play any game Arena Net or NCSoft produce.

Firebaall

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Sep 2006

28 May 2010 at 17:40 - 313

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mangione

Yes. Termination was (and IS) appropriate.
You bot. You lose.

Want a new account? Go buy another one.

As far as I know, they are not allowed to do that. Without first getting permission.

Zarion Silverarrow

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2008

Puerto Rico

The Annunaki Interventionists

P/W

28 May 2010 at 17:42 - 314

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riot Narita

So you say. And we can trust the word of a person who was banned for cheating/botting. Yeah right. /sarcasm

You got banned. You know why. You knew the rules. You knew the consequences if you got caught. You accepted that risk.

But now you got caught. And instead of accepting the consequences of your own actions, the risk you took... you want the rules to be changed. So that you can be unbanned.

Aint gonna happen. Move on.

Once again,the fact that you belive me or not changes nothing.

I know what I did,and I know I took it back WAY before the ban.

And,once again,I'm here to discuss the situation itself and IF I should be banned in other people's opinion,but since YOU don't belive me,OFC you will say "Yes,ban him"

People were mad,because bots had advantages over them and were abussing them...I understand this,but just answer this:

I,as an individual,only used 2 bots for 10 seconds each...for a sum of about 20 steps taken in 2 towns...nothing else...all I did was walk around...now tell me,how does that affect your gameplay?

Kharmin

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2009

Far Shiverpeaks

Clan Quarren [QRRN]

R/

28 May 2010 at 17:45 - 315

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

Nice point there... I guess the 2 week ban should include loss of items/gold/titles points gained in the last X months or something....its a problem though,because you wouldn't know how long the person has been botting (i think)...maybe keep the account without items/tittles/etc...

Thanks. My point continues to be that the Company simply does not have the resources available to assign to keeping track of things like this and then also responding to those who feel unjustly temp banned. You have your specific 10, 20, how ever many steps case that you are advocating, but I submit to you that for your case there are probably hundreds (perhaps thousands) of other specific cases that would have to be adjudicated on a case-by-case basis... on a continually rolling time-line and they simply cannot maintain that method.

It isn't practical business sense, IMO.

Ghost Dog

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2008

W/

28 May 2010 at 17:48 - 316

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

Once again,the fact that you belive me or not changes nothing.

I know what I did,and I know I took it back WAY before the ban.

And,once again,I'm here to discuss the situation itself and IF I should be banned in other people's opinion,but since YOU don't belive me,OFC you will say "Yes,ban him"

People were mad,because bots had advantages over them and were abussing them...I understand this,but just answer this:

I,as an individual,only used 2 bots for 10 seconds each...for a sum of about 20 steps taken in 2 towns...nothing else...all I did was walk around...now tell me,how does that affect your gameplay?

I don't care about how it affected my gameplay, nor does ANET, it's about how you affected your own gameplay, did you choose to bot is a yes or no question.

This reminds me of how to catch a predator I ONLY CAME HERE TO WARN HER!1111

Firebaall

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Sep 2006

28 May 2010 at 17:48 - 317

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

Once again,the fact that you belive me or not changes nothing.

I know what I did,and I know I took it back WAY before the ban.

And,once again,I'm here to discuss the situation itself and IF I should be banned in other people's opinion,but since YOU don't belive me,OFC you will say "Yes,ban him"

The only way...and I mean the only way you would deserve a temp ban, is if you contacted support before getting banned and explained what you did, and it was only a momentary usage.

Tell them everything, and provide the bot software to them as a report on yourself. Otherwise, you're just another botter that broke the rules, and hoped you didn't get caught. Black and White.

Zarion Silverarrow

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2008

Puerto Rico

The Annunaki Interventionists

P/W

28 May 2010 at 17:49 - 318

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kharmin

Thanks. My point continues to be that the Company simply does not have the resources available to assign to keeping track of things like this and then also responding to those who feel unjustly temp banned. You have your specific 10, 20, how ever many steps case that you are advocating, but I submit to you that for your case there are probably hundreds (perhaps thousands) of other specific cases that would have to be adjudicated on a case-by-case basis... on a continually rolling time-line and they simply cannot maintain that method.

It isn't practical business sense, IMO.

I agree but that isn't what I'm discussing....I am almost sure my ban won't be taken off,but this is because of their resources...

My English isn't that good so I'm getting a headache trying to explain lol...

What I mean is,that I'm discussing here to figure out whether yes or not does the community think,that if A-net could do it,I would be unbanned...The only reason I am banned (IMO,and the opinon of about 40% of people here that agree with me) is because A-net can't tell if I botted for 10 years or 10 seconds.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghost Dog

I don't care about how it affected my gameplay, nor does ANET, it's about how you affected your own gameplay, did you choose to bot is a yes or no question.

This reminds me of how to catch a predator I ONLY CAME HERE TO WARN HER!1111

No,I don't consider the action of walking for a few seconds to be "Gameplay"

cormac ap dunn

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2007

Mystic Empires III [xMEx]

Me/

28 May 2010 at 17:50 - 319

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zarion Silverarrow

Once again,the fact that you belive me or not changes nothing.

I know what I did,and I know I took it back WAY before the ban.

And,once again,I'm here to discuss the situation itself and IF I should be banned in other people's opinion,but since YOU don't belive me,OFC you will say "Yes,ban him"

People were mad,because bots had advantages over them and were abussing them...I understand this,but just answer this:

I,as an individual,only used 2 bots for 10 seconds each...for a sum of about 20 steps taken in 2 towns...nothing else...all I did was walk around...now tell me,how does that affect your gameplay?

you are here to get someone, ANYONE to say unban you, not to discuss it, it was effectivly discussed, the answer seems to be you deserve it. just on the numbers i've seen. so there is your answer, hopefully a mod will close this soon. you are only here to discuss just your case, thought this was a community forum, not a Zarion Silverarrow forum. get over your self already

Kharmin

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2009

Far Shiverpeaks

Clan Quarren [QRRN]

R/

28 May 2010 at 17:50 - 320

Quote:

Originally Posted by Firebaall

The only way...and I mean the only way you would deserve a temp ban, is if you contacted support before getting banned and explained what you did, and it was only a momentary usage.

Tell them everything, and provide the bot software to them as a report on yourself. Otherwise, you're just another botter that broke the rules, and hoped you didn't get caught. Black and White.

Stupid hind-sight. Always 20/20.

Hopefully for Z S, support will review the case and rule in Z S's favor.