Is anyone else worried about the new salvage options?

i know, i was reaffirming the point of the thread, which had been lost after 14 pages.

I think we were both talking about weaponsmiths and collectors. No, they're not available from them at all. I know the mods in general are rare when just looking for a drop. I've only come across three shields with +8-10 vs. certain damage types. I've only seen one off-hand with any armor vs. a certain damage type (blunt), so I know others exist, it's just brutally rare.

How does anyone suggest getting mods like those aside from spending an arm and a leg? It means spellcasters can't really be competitive without being rich in many cases, since there are no cheap copies.

This whole discussion so far has been on warrior weapons. I'm trying to show that this will affect more than just that one class, and more than just Hammers, Swords, and Axes. Why is so much emphasis put on just those three weapons, anyway?

Foolish warrior elitists and their toys are in severe need of a swift kick in the pockets anyway. They can't see through their own crystallines, despite their translucency. Yes, the entire Guild Wars economy revolves around one class and their shiny weapons. That is the part I find entirely bizarre and possibly the part that Anet is trying to repair with inscriptions.

yea I got a guildie that thinks just like that. he is pissed cause he doesn't like to PLAY he farms. and sorry but that is freaking boring... I went with him a few time a week for a while just for him, and I was soo freaking bored doing UW I was ready to pull my hair out after like the 8th or 9th time doing the same crap over and over and over... I was like Jesus you want ecto so bad here take it... I gave him like 20 ecto I had saved up in storage. whats he do??? Flips it and goes back for more... Its not like he is even trying to get anything its just all he does... Whatever... I just don't get the concept or the draw of this kind of boring strategy... Is it any wonder other MMO games are eliminating gold as a standard for item acquisition? New systems are based on Honor and merit, Not how much you farm. We can only hope that comes to GW soon.

You mean like “zombie farming,” (“must get ecto’s for no reason argggggggg”) yeah that can be really boring at times (not to mention repetitive). I personally love the ones who take it so seriously and I quote, “if I did not farm for ecto’s the GW economy, and the world would fall to shambles.”

Anyways I don’t see the problem with this whole salvage option yet from my point of view; I find that if anything it might cause a small ripple effect but nothing else. That’s why A-net goes through the whole testing phase and sees things that they might scrap ahead of time. I mean why should we be all that concerned that everything is going to fall apart. I’ve stated it once before and all state it again: If all else fail A-net will fix it, but if it isn’t broke why fix it though.

I think it is a great idea.It will improve the game for alot of folks.They can do salvage and make better weapons.Sounds good to me.I pretty sure most folks bought the game to play it.Not spending all their time farming and spamming for items at the towns.
I happen to farm but I have all 20s.Still I go out and help out on missions and such.
Bottom line I dont really care what someone else has.Fow Armor big woop.If that is what you like more power to you.It doesnt impress me a bit.Someone who works with others does.So if salvage can get him/her better equipment that just makes the game better.
Someone brought up D2.Well I played for 3 years and some of the folks that played had pure crap.They still went out and tried.I always gave a bunch of stuff away because it embarassed me that the games drops were so pathetic most of the time that new people had to use junk.I was a big time Mfer so had more than I could ever use.
I think Anet should get a pat on the back for trying to improve the game for all.

Everyone in this topic fails to mention the reason WHY anet would do this IF they do it - PvP...

PvPers don't want to farm to look leet in PvP, they just want perfect 15^50 / 15% no neg mods on their awesome looking weapons. The problem is, high req weapons are already a relatively cheap means of doing this, and IMHO, this would be going overboard :/

You don't know the reason why any more than we do... that's why no one is mentioning it.

I personally believe it's because weapon prices are so high. If Anet wanted weapons to cost over 100,000 - they wouldn't have capped that amount as the max tradeable.

That's why I think Anet is doing it. After all, Anet has said, the only difference between a PvE and PvP player should be looks. (Which is why I also think they'll "fix" the armor swapping issue and weapon slots in PvP soon, but that's for another thread rant).

I missed this before, good points arcanemacabre.

Like most "nerfs" that Anet introduces, this will actually end up being a net buff!

Of course, most people only see their Crystalline prices going down, and are blind to the fact that whole new markets will open up.

This is going to be good for the game, if it works like we expect.

Are you guys saying that 15>50 will be a salvageable mod?!

Well, according to PC gamer, "inherent bonus modifiers" will be removable as "Inscriptions." We're assuming that will include 15>50 modifiers, as well as previously unavailable modifiers on shields, wands, foci, etc.

Nothing confirmed by Anet yet, though.

Well, I really hate to say this, but if this is indeed the case, this may very well be the last nail in the coffin. It's just not something that I'd be willing to accept, and that's final, unfortunately.

yes, you can basily salvage 15>50 mod.10% universal recharge mod or any other mods on any weapon and apply it on any weapon of any skins. in the long run, ppl will have w/e they want.Personally , i think that they 3 new features on NF are all connected, First, we got the hero system, which require A LARGE Amount of items. An average player who play tho all 3 chapters should have antealt 7 characters. 7x3 heroes=21 characters you need to supply items to. 21 charactersx2 items.. are alot of items you need to get... if they dont make the new salvage kit, it will drive the price of items crazy, most ppl can't get the full benefit from hero system. so anet introduce the inscription kit which you can mod any items any way any skins. which will bring down the price so ppl can buy items for their heroes. auction house in nifhtfall will accelerated the selling and buying processes and ppl can sell faster, buy fasters and focus more in actuall play. and by salvage each component of perfect itmes seperate. they can sell a perfect godl items by 4 pieces, For Examply, i got a req8 15^50 20/20 sundering hp+30 war axe.
i can get the 15^50 mod, the req8 gold axe,20/20 sundering haft and hp+30 grip, i can list each of them for seperate price. since auction house can probalby only takes up to 100k. players have to buy each compoent seperately to get their perfect gold items. well jus a guess but i think that is how the 3 new features work togethor.

Well, that's one way they can implement this. Another way would be the unlocking of inherent mods. Once it's unlocked by identifying an item, it's made available to heroes. Doesn't cost any money, either. Equipping heroes in my opinion is way too much micromanagement, and really not casual-player friendly.

that is exactly what i am tryign to say. it is like Ok the almighty gwen and Gaile checking out our forum. and they see req8 15^50 chaos sold for 100k+100ectos and alot of ppl want it. so they did is to raise the drop rate so everyone can have. they change their mind overnight adding and removing things at their will without telling us. i know they are reading this thread right here right now. i just hope Gaile have some mercy on us and leave the old world<tyria and cantha> in peace.

y would u bring real world into this discussion. It’s a game, fantasy, magic etc. nothing to do with real world. People play for different reason, some play for wealth, items, and rank.

If this game resembled anything to the real world it wouldn’t be fun.

Has any one thought that there is a possibility that anet might put a twist in this whole inscription thing. Where if u use it turns your weapon red or something. If that happens gold’s will still retain their value, hell i will go up even more.

You wann discuss something discuss it. don’t drag real world values into it, it has no place in a virtual game, economy market etc. If u r gonna drag real world situations into it then lets. Why should you be allowed to sit in your nice cozy room with a nice computer and play games 2-3 hours a day, its not fair to the homeless guy down the street. he gets to rot in his small little card board box and has no say in what happens to his life.

Player A played 300 hours and got a really nice drop ex. 15^50 req8 storm. sells the items, makes the players day seeing as his play time was rewarded with a nice item and some spending cash.

Player B plays 5 hours buys inscription buys him self a cheap clean storm bow mods it.

Doesn’t sound fair to the guy who just put in hundreds of hours.

Though this inscriptions does sound interesting, guess we will all have to wait month more to see what is gonn happen. No point in bickering about it. I feel that anet will put some kind of twist in the inscriptions, to keep the farmers, traders happy. If not they will lose a lot of players and potential future customers. Besides whats the point in a game if u cant show off even just a little bit for your hard work [playing]

Flame On

but you know you have to supply your fellow hero your OWN ITEMS RIGHT?
you have to buy them the weapon and runes.

Personally, I'm not opposed to change, but there're good changes and unfortunately, there're bad changes. I think this change would fall into the bad category. ANet will do what they think is best for the game, let's hope they will make the right decision.

I fear that if they do go ahead with this, they're going to lose a lot of players, myself included.

That's why I think it's not casual-player friendly, even if they make inherent mods salvageable. Casual players aren't going to have the time/resources to equip all of their heroes, and more hardcore players will be upset because all of their items will have depreciated in value drastically. In effect, it will piss off everyone, casual or hardcore.

I dont know if anyone thought of this, but to me a clear and easy solution to this whole discussion would be for Anet to implement inscriptions in the following way.

You can only add inscriptions to Customized items.

I think this would keep the rarity factor legit for those that collect items, and for the PVE(P)ers out there they can get the skin/inherent/moded weapon they want in a cheap usable fashion.

I dont know, to me I think that would be the easiest way to keep everyone happy, I think the value of items would still go down a bit, but I dont think it would plumment.

This is a very important point in this whole discussion we are having. Most of the people rallying against this are not taking the heros into account here. I believe that the economy may perhaps take a hit at first, but it will build back up as people start to need more and more items for their heros. The game is changing and we need to change with it.

Personally, I don't like this reactive line of thinking. Of course, if ANet has decided to do something, we can't really do anything about it. But according to ANet, they will take our input before making a decision; if that's at all true, I think it would be helpful if we let ANet know what we really think, instead of acquiescing to whatever decision they make.

In my replies, I did take the hero system into account, and I gave alternatives. As a casual player, which ANet claims to make up the majority of their player base, I'm simply not going to have enough time/resources to equip all of my heroes, even if inherent mods were salvageable.

[QUOTE]they want it way down not a bit.

they are steadly making price drops in the game and this is the next.

EXAMPLES?

1 guild sigels were out of the price range of the casual player so they increased the drop rate and there was a fire sale of people putting sigels up for sale in 30 unit lots (this site)

2 superior absorb runes were 100k when they increased the drop rate in april (well before the damage adjustment) and they went to about 4k.

Anet is opening the game to the casual player who wants some item because it looks nice not because it is super rare to show off wealth

Well if you think about it though items are only "really" worth what you can actually get someone to spend on the item. With the current broken economy flooded with insane amounts of ebay gold it is no wonder items are so expensive now. Now if ANet gives more spending freedom to the average player ebay farmers will not have such a large interest in the game and will eventually move on. I believe ANet is trying to deal a death blow to the ebay farmers. Once the ebay farmers are out of the equation finally the market can be influenced by the average farmers and average players. Prices on items will drop down to where they were intended to be and the game will stabilize itself.

[QUOTE=Loviatar]I think if a player was only allowed to put an inscription on a customized item that casual players would have an easy way to get the "pretty" items with the perfect mods on it. Besides they already did this with green items.

And for the skins not covered by the greens a casual player could buy a cheap white weapon with the skin they like, customize it and add the mods.

And it would still allow people that collect items to have the perfect uncustomized gold items in their collection.

There's got to be a better way to deal with botters and ebayers than destroying the very economy itself. It's like saying let's let the stock market crash so that we can get rid of all the inside trading. I'm afraid it doesn't quite work that way.

I also fail to see how this will benefit the average player. Personally, I'd rather be doing missions and quests and whatever, instead of trying to figure out how to get the items to equip the heroes.

I think as long as a mod is unlocked, it should also be made available to the heroes. That would solve a lot of the problems.

No, it's not fair, and that's why I brought the "real world" into it.

People get scammed all the time in Guild Wars. Is it fair? No. But it happens, just like in real life.

I play the game for one hour and get a super rare drop. Someone else plays for thousands of hours, and never gets it. Fair? Nope. But it happens.

My point was this: If you are paying (or selling) items for more than they are worth to the merchant, you are taking a risk. That value is "artificial" (as opposed to the "real" value of anything in a game!)

People are making comparisons to trading like playing the stock market... and that's fair, to a point. If the stock marker was controlled by one business who could change the entire economy with one patch.

I guess Tommy's real question was, "should we expect economic changes like this in the future?" And my reply is, yes, you should. This is not a static single-player game. This is an evolving MORPG (or CORP), and as such, you can expect the stats of items you have to change (as has happened), and item values to change (as has happened).

Ahh, such a nice fantasy. But I fear that eBay farmers will exist as long as the servers are on. They will continue to flood the market with ill-gotten gold, consistently raising prices on everything.

If I were to guess on what the devs intended for a GW economy, it would be this: No item would go over the 1,000 plat limit. Ectos and shards are materials for buying FoW armor. Most high-end items would never go past 100k, the max you can carry.

I don't know about you, but these things seem pretty obvious to me. The way everything is set up, do you really think they meant for salvage materials to become currency? I'm thinking they've been disgusted by the economy for a long time, but had no idea how to really fix it without ruffling too many skirts. Sorry to say, but this might just be the best way.

DID YOU NOTICE...........?

QUOTE THE ARTICLE
this will make equiping a hero more casual gamer friendly

Raise your hand if you have perfect caster weapons! This does not include greens (which for me, have 1 mod of the 2 I want, or have a terrible skin so therefore NOT perfect).
Of those that raised your hand, what did they cost you?
Salvaging those mods will FINALLY allow me to get the skins I want with the mods I want for 4/6 characters I have. My monk, mesmer, ele, and necro are going to have a field day.
So sorry for warriors and their 15^50 req 7-8 market of super high priced goods. This ONE mod seems to be the highlight of this thread. 15^50 15^50 15^50 15^50. Look at the other 6 non-melee classes as well please.

Gold might actually be worth something now. When I first started playing this game (thousands of hours ago) I noticed gold was terribly worthless. Something I thought was not a good sign. This should not happen, you should be able to afford a decent living (in GW case = skills, armor, weaponry) without breaking the bank on a regular basis. A couple of thousand gold coins should be able to buy you something good.
The more I think about this "inscriptions" add-on the more I start to like it (especially once someone brought up the caster scenario).

Some skins are still REALLY rare and others would become rare if certain behaviours ceased. Crys and Dwarven Axes only drop in HoH. Noone whining that the only way to get a "pve" item is to become a pvp buff and sit and win HoH for hours a day in hopes to get one. Its just a fact so you deal with it.
They could modify drop rates for a lot of items so they drop less frequently maintaining a "rare" enviorment. They could remove (omg, but thats my favorite part of the game too!) chests from GW. As I mentioned before, people are still suckers for looks. A gold item with the same stats as a purple one sells for a higher price (This happened to me many times in Factions). You cannot salvage the req either.
This will deflate prices, although I do not believe to the point where it will make the economy crash. There will be a wider variety of good available for sale. As long as people are playing the game, which ever angle they prefer, and there is an influx of new players there will always be an economy. The bot farmers and chest runners will have more of an impact on the economy at this point than the introduction of the salvage option. The bot farmers will have many perfect mods for sale flooding the market and the chest runners will have rare skins readily available flooding the market as well.

For those with 1750e+ in storage who will not like this, you should. This will make you richer. You will lose the value of some of your weapons, but it will increase the value of your millions of gold. The coin itself will be going up instead of the weapon value going down if you will. You will be able to buy more stuff (if there is still anything you dont have) with the 10+ million gold you are sitting on now than before. Those with a mere 40,000 gold in storage will be able to afford more in tradable items (while maintaining the colossal gold sink of armor should you choose to put 1 or more sets of 15k armor per character or, god forbid, FoW armor).

The introduction of this salvage option might deflate the economy and bring it back to a reasonable level. Yes, I have some of these high priced items that each is currently worth more than 300k and they are my babies. When they added +5 energy mods to all weapons people hollered and hooted that the HoD sword would become worthless. I knew that it would happen dropping from swords value from 500k to ~50k in a day well before it happened, but I kept it because its an original. On that little note, someone offered me close to its worth before the crash because it is exactly that, unique. (Collectors will pay a lot of money for stuff you deem worthless. Stamps anyone?)

Someone divided up this game with :
low/middle/high classes. Shame on you.
If there has to be a division, the only one in this game should be :
skilled / unskilled.

Not the haves and have nots.

The traders can still have fun with the game, they just remove a zero or two from their trades and voila, same challenge. Instead of racking in millions you racking in hundereds of thousands.

-its long now, so im done-
(lets not bring Hitler and Communism into this again if you please, GW and those two real world events are worlds apart)

[QUOTE=Loviatar]It depends what you define as a casual gamer. Amount of time played? Well in the last 2 months I have played Guild Wars for 60 hours which is about 1 hour a day. In that time im not 100% sure but have certainly made way over 2 million gold.

However, if you define a casual gamer as someone who does not obsess over perfect stats / rare items / 15k armor / fow armor etc then they would not care about all the expensive items out there.

If a casual gamer is someone who wants nice stuff but doesnt have the time then it is still possible to do as I have mentioned earlier.

If they claim they cannot make gold easily then I am afraid that is their own problem. They cant stick to using cookie cutter farming guides etc to do it. If Anet want to cater to the mindless player then that is a very sad thing. I had a friend who made 2 million gold from candy canes alone and I consider him a casual gamer as he has a job and family to care for.

Now buying slightly imperfect items such as 14>50 ones would cut the cost of obtaining good rare items. The difference in dmg between 14>50 and 15>50 is like .40 or something. It would not hurt to use 1 off perfect items.

I have 10/10 staffs, wands and rods. I have maybe around 40 or so but am not 100% sure. Now how much did they cost me? Most cost me 10-20k. I have bought perfect wands and rods with 5>50 Energy and 10% Recharge for 3k and 10/10 ones for the around that also.

I also have 10/20 staffs which some cost as low as 10k.

I also have 20/20 staffs which some cost as low as 20k and others up to 30k.

They all all totally usable. I know for a fact perfect caster items are obtainable and cheap as I have bought tons. Every single one of my caster chars has two staffs for each attribute line. I also have +1 20% staffs for each attribute line.

Yes, and no.

I assume it has to be customized to the character the hero is linked to.

So, if I'm a Warrior and want to give a Monk hero a customized wand, I have to customize a wand for my warrior. Which will only be useful for the hero. So, yes, this will require extra work for the casual player, but with the abundance of Crafters and Collector items, I'm not worried about that.

I'm more worried about space for all my Hero's weapons...

Why do you see it as crashing the stock market? The high end rare skins will still be rare and the pricing for such weapons will still be high compared to the rest of the items. Just because they are not worth as much now as they were when you bought them doesn't mean they are not still rare. If you decide to sell your rare skinned perfect item you will still get compensation for it and it will still sell for enough that you can still buy that weapon you want. Only thing this will really effect is that now obtaining ecto will take longer unless ecto prices drop too. I would suspect that ecto will probably drop in price as will all the crafting materials. This is not as big as a deal as you think because if things are cheaper as a whole then that means you can finish off that collection you were working on.

Hmm, I don't want to farm, but I still want perfect mods and "Inscriptions."

What are my options?

Because it's the same principle. If I have 100 shares of Microsoft, and Microsoft prices drop, does that mean my 100 shares still have the same value? Of course not. Did I lose money in the process? You bet I did! If this is implemented, you're essentially asking people to be okay with losing loads of money that they worked hard for. I don't think that's gonna go over very well with anyone.

That's why collector/crafter/green items exist.

no i read it just the opposite.

the hero can use any uncustomized drop and has the ability to use your customized hand me downs as well instead of i would like to give it to him but its customized for me.

HAND DOWN

note also the use of unlocked skills.

no mention of buying skills just using unlocked skills

COOL!

I thought it was a bug that my Heros could use my customized items

I had Koss using my Canthan Targe preorder shield. And I gave the Dervish my customized Bonus Scythe. Koss looked cool as hell with that captain america looking shield too.

Well, that's all well and good, and that is how it worked in the open beta, but there's one fundamental flaw with the 'hand-me-down' idea: This only works if you happen to be the same class using the same weapon as your hero. This is highly unlikely as you'd probably want heroes of different classes to compliment your build, I'd assume.

It would just be all-around better if they allowed the heroes to use 'PvP-style' items that can be modded on the fly with unlocked mods & inscriptions. Then also allow other items to be equipped instead, if you want your hero to have a unique skin. That way everybody wins.

Using your example, you have "Insider Information." You know those items will go down, and rare low-req, clean skins will probably go up.

If I was a Trader, I'd be selling all my perfect rares, and investing in what I thought the new thing would be.


As has been discussed, not all Mods or Inherent Bonuses are available on Collectors, Crafters, or Greens (like I'm gonna farm Greens anyway).

Basically, I'm opposite of you. I don't want to deal in trading at all... shouldn't the game have options for me?

What I'd really like to see is a Mod and Inscription Trader (like Rune trader).

Not to mention skins...


But especially the inherent mods on wands/staves/off-hands/shields/etc. Milias, please don't forget those. Consider all the possibilities, not just 15^50's...

If there was all inherent combinations covered by anet would there still be a problem? What if Anet also made the collectors skins more attractive?

I do find the lack of +10al collectors shields unfair and would rather anet added them so they could be obtained by collectors.

Huh? I wasn't talking about insider trading, I was talking about the perceived value in "perfect" items. Just like stocks, it's a perceived value, and like stocks, when stock prices go down, you lose money.

I believe most inherent bonuses are available in the form of collector/crafter/green items. Also keep in mind that if some change is made to benefit you, it will come at a cost to someone else, which in this case, is people like me.