Why have 25 heros to use 3 at a time?
Jongo River
Same reqs as hardmode sounds good, but protector would be a pain, because some bonuses are pretty tricky with henchies - which is one of the main reasons I'd like to see 7 heroes!
zwei2stein
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Originally Posted by mr_groovy
Here's a thought for Anet. Why don't set it up as hard mode?
Complete each Campaign and u get to unlock to have a 7 hero party. Or to put it a bit steaper, get with 1 char protector on that campaign to unlock it. Newbies still would pug to gether, and the people who finished it can pursue there vanquish/ guardian / elite mission, whatever. I say Win Win situation. |
0mt = 1hero available.
every maxxed title - one additional hero slot, up to 11 heroes for urgoz.
----
Thou, seriously, its silly to introduce ability to have more heroes yet artificially limit it. I wouldn't fear newbies having access to heroes and not socializing, because for newbie, heroes would be useless anyway thanks to lack of unlocks, money to equip them and bad newbie builds that would be given to them would make playing with players much more desirable.
Aera Lure
/unsigned
I dont see a need for it and do feel it makes single-player play far too easy, to the point of encouraging it. Nothing in the game that is required is too hard to do with just henchmen, let alone with three Heroes. Most things for Guardian can be done H/H if you are savvy, and that was pre-GWEN consumables. All that is required if you cannot do something H/H is find a single other player - friend, guildie, random - who would like to do the same thing as you.
My opinion aside, Gaile has stated in one of multiple topics about this that they wont be expanding to 7 hero player use. Someone who tracks Gaile's remarks could probably find it. The only circumstance I can see that might reverse their decision is if GW ever fell to some truly low number of players prior to GW2's release, but I see that as somewhat unlikely.
I dont see a need for it and do feel it makes single-player play far too easy, to the point of encouraging it. Nothing in the game that is required is too hard to do with just henchmen, let alone with three Heroes. Most things for Guardian can be done H/H if you are savvy, and that was pre-GWEN consumables. All that is required if you cannot do something H/H is find a single other player - friend, guildie, random - who would like to do the same thing as you.
My opinion aside, Gaile has stated in one of multiple topics about this that they wont be expanding to 7 hero player use. Someone who tracks Gaile's remarks could probably find it. The only circumstance I can see that might reverse their decision is if GW ever fell to some truly low number of players prior to GW2's release, but I see that as somewhat unlikely.
mr_groovy
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Originally Posted by Jongo River
Same reqs as hardmode sounds good, but protector would be a pain, because some bonuses are pretty tricky with henchies - which is one of the main reasons I'd like to see 7 heroes!
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.
eudas
to the OP:
two words: "money sink".
heroes are the biggest, best money sink that anet has ever invented for this game.
eudas
two words: "money sink".
heroes are the biggest, best money sink that anet has ever invented for this game.
eudas
Bryant Again
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Originally Posted by Drop of Fear
i guess we will have 7 heroes groups when gw2 will be released and gw1 will prolly be deserted, yet the servers still up for a long time
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CyberMesh0
/pokes the dead horse
Anet said long ago that 7 hero parties were not feasible since the system was built around the 3 hero setup. I highly doubt they have the resources (and/or financial motivation) to change it now.
Anet said long ago that 7 hero parties were not feasible since the system was built around the 3 hero setup. I highly doubt they have the resources (and/or financial motivation) to change it now.
upier
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Aera Lure
/unsigned
I dont see a need for it and do feel it makes single-player play far too easy, to the point of encouraging it. Nothing in the game that is required is too hard to do with just henchmen, let alone with three Heroes. Most things for Guardian can be done H/H if you are savvy, and that was pre-GWEN consumables. All that is required if you cannot do something H/H is find a single other player - friend, guildie, random - who would like to do the same thing as you. |
I can reach max survivor in 15 hours.
It's too easy!
Make it 10 million xp!
AND if you fail to make a survivor - your account gets banned.
AND everyone needs to go for survivor.
The game is just to easy otherwise!
Ohh wait - you don't want to be FORCED to go for survivor?
Well - tough luck!
It's just to easy otherwise!
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Originally Posted by eudas
to the OP:
two words: "money sink". heroes are the biggest, best money sink that anet has ever invented for this game. eudas |
There is no point in me owning GWEN because I can only use 3 heroes. Now if I wanted to run my perfect party though the whole game - I'd NEED GWEN. And that would be worth obtaining GWEN for.
And that would be a REAL LIFE money sink that A.Net could benefit from.
Now if there are only 3 heroes - my party is limited. That limits my fun. That means I play less. And playing less before I even get interested in GW2 means I just might skip it. And that means I save money.
Ohh wait - having less heroes is GOOD then!
freekedoutfish
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Originally Posted by Holly Herro
They want us to play the game for longer.
It'd be too easy with 7 perfect players. That's why they introduced heroes, so people wouldn't PUG and would pick up henchies, that are in reality, worse than puggers. Usually :P /unsigned It'd be too easy/boring.. |
This is the crunch to the arguement in favour of this. Its no different using 7 runed and maxed out heroes then it is using 7 highly experienced humans. And you cant always find exprienced players to help you, or even find humans or guildies to help. Relying on (what are now redundant) henches, isnt far.
When heroes were added, the entire hench system should have had a re-hall too and added more functionality.
At the least they should let us choose or see the hench skills. One issues ive always had with henches is I cant see what their using. I dont know the difference between a guardian warrior and a brawling warrior. Ive never played a warrior and im not an expert.
How can you realistically choose a team of AI players if you dont know what your entire team is using. Its pot luck really and that isnt tactfull. Atleast with humans you can ask them to ping their build.
GWs is meant to be about skill, but choosing AI players who could be using anything isnt skill. Its just desperation!
eudas
Quote:
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Originally Posted by upier
The only problem is that unless the money sink is available in real life - they don't gain much from it.
There is no point in me owning GWEN because I can only use 3 heroes. Now if I wanted to run my perfect party though the whole game - I'd NEED GWEN. And that would be worth obtaining GWEN for. And that would be a REAL LIFE money sink that A.Net could benefit from. Now if there are only 3 heroes - my party is limited. That limits my fun. That means I play less. And playing less before I even get interested in GW2 means I just might skip it. And that means I save money. Ohh wait - having less heroes is GOOD then! |
And, it is an in-game money sink to equip them up. So they get you to sink money into the new expansion to fuel the OCD/pokemon "collect them all!" tendencies of the playerbase, and they get to draw money out of coffers into the merchants to make it go away. win/win for them.
your party being "limited" is not a concern of theirs. they've already stated that if they wanted, they could've made the AI play the game itself.
eudas
Lil Ferk
How is playing with 7 perfect heroes, any different to playing with 7 really experienced human players? Answer = it isnt!
yes it is they don't talk to u it's a lonely world out there
yes it is they don't talk to u it's a lonely world out there
upier
Quote:
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Originally Posted by eudas
Youre missing the point. Having new heroes means they can put a bullet point on all marketing/promo materials for GWEN (or any other expansion): "8 new heroes!"
And, it is an in-game money sink to equip them up. So they get you to sink money into the new expansion to fuel the OCD/pokemon "collect them all!" tendencies of the playerbase, and they get to draw money out of coffers into the merchants to make it go away. win/win for them. your party being "limited" is not a concern of theirs. they've already stated that if they wanted, they could've made the AI play the game itself. eudas |
I don't see how it's a win-win for them if I am NOT buying GWEN because I can only use 3 heroes? And that's REAL LIFE money we are talking about.
eudas
Quote:
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Originally Posted by upier
Aye - but if they would allow full hero parties they could write "8 new heroes THAT YOU CAN USE!"
I don't see how it's a win-win for them if I am NOT buying GWEN because I can only use 3 heroes? And that's REAL LIFE money we are talking about. |
eudas
Toriyaki
I thought that having up to 25 heroes just means you can have more than one hero of the same profession in your party o_O
I'm fine with only three heroes. It's just one of those game restrictions not really worth talking about...
I'm fine with only three heroes. It's just one of those game restrictions not really worth talking about...
eudas
i agree, tori, but some people think it's an obstacle set up by The Man, who's just Keeping 'Em Down (tm).
eudas
eudas
Hermos
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Originally Posted by bhavv
I would like to just make my 7 bars that would get through everything just fine.
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UTTER FAIL.
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Originally Posted by freekedoutfish
How is playing with 7 perfect heroes, any different to playing with 7 really experienced human players? Answer = it isnt!
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Isileth
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Originally Posted by Hermos
LOL. Apart from the amazing reflexes, not having to actually gain the friendship of them before playing and not having to be in a guild/alliance/talk program (vent, ts, skype). Those are the main things that make heroes different from those experienced human players.
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Along with the patented "You didnt make friends with me so im going to stand in AoE" AI.
Severlator
/signed for 7 hero teams, I very rarly use PUG's unless me and some friends are planning on doing it anyway but if i'm on my own I can chill out and take my time with A.I.
Taurucis
I'm fully behind this idea. It's hard as heck to get groups for me (I don't have EotN, so that means little to no PuGs for me, I can't run EotN gimmick builds, and most of my alliance is running EotN stuff) and I'd love to play with 7 heroes.
Look, all you people who scream "7 HEROES MAKES THE GAME UNSOCIABLE! WE MUST PUG WE MUST PUG!" You can go ahead and skyrocket your stress levels pugging, alright? There are some of us loners, and also some of us people who are hated for no apparent reason, who would just prefer to play with 7 heroes.
Look, all you people who scream "7 HEROES MAKES THE GAME UNSOCIABLE! WE MUST PUG WE MUST PUG!" You can go ahead and skyrocket your stress levels pugging, alright? There are some of us loners, and also some of us people who are hated for no apparent reason, who would just prefer to play with 7 heroes.
Anduin
I never play with real people anymore.
And that was long before Nightfall came out.
Why shouldn't I have the option to play how I want? Those who don't want 7 heroes in their party, don't have to use them. Why should those who want to play a different way be restricted?
It would make the game closer to Baldur's Gate, which would mean I would hate it a lot less, and actually buy the sequel. As it stands now, there is no way in hell I am touching it.
Oh, and I am all for the use of 7 heroes. My brother can't play everytime I do, so it would be nice to be able to make up a full team that can do hard mode when he isn't on. Henchmen stink.
And that was long before Nightfall came out.
Why shouldn't I have the option to play how I want? Those who don't want 7 heroes in their party, don't have to use them. Why should those who want to play a different way be restricted?
It would make the game closer to Baldur's Gate, which would mean I would hate it a lot less, and actually buy the sequel. As it stands now, there is no way in hell I am touching it.
Oh, and I am all for the use of 7 heroes. My brother can't play everytime I do, so it would be nice to be able to make up a full team that can do hard mode when he isn't on. Henchmen stink.
freekedoutfish
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Originally Posted by Hermos
So... you're saying you want to make an international MMORPG so easy it could be completely soloable.
UTTER FAIL. |
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Hermos
LOL. Apart from the amazing reflexes, not having to actually gain the friendship of them before playing and not having to be in a guild/alliance/talk program (vent, ts, skype). Those are the main things that make heroes different from those experienced human players.
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Do you have little social gatherings and talk about the "good old days" and share bread before you enter a mission or instance with your PUG?
What if your not in a guild, or your guild is almost always dead or no one ever helps? There is absolutely nothing different between using 7 heroes and using 7 real people! None at all!
Otherwise are you trying to argue that the AI for heroes is more intelligent then human intelligence? Hmmmm!
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Toriyaki
I'm fine with only three heroes. It's just one of those game restrictions not really worth talking about...
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Why shouldnt be have an alternative to fix that situation of using all heroes?
Tyla
Quote:
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Originally Posted by freekedoutfish
Why shouldnt be have an alternative to fix that situation of using all heroes?
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anyway on topic...because each one looks different
one may look cooler than the other or vice versa.
and it cuts off the fact that alot of the playerbase dont understand how to make a good build because alot of people farm with the same holy trinity build over and over.
and will just never learn because they are too attached to the popularity of the build so basically nothing is changing
Crom The Pale
/signed for 7 heros.
Necromonger
To repeat
- It can't be overpowered, 1 Human, 7 Heroes will not be better than a good all human party (note I said good), and that is what the game must have been designed for (can't tell me it was designed for 8 noobs)
- It would be great to allow great build synergy experiments
- Some outposts in the older games really are empty, to allow us to go back and have fun, why not?
- /signed ...
- It can't be overpowered, 1 Human, 7 Heroes will not be better than a good all human party (note I said good), and that is what the game must have been designed for (can't tell me it was designed for 8 noobs)
- It would be great to allow great build synergy experiments
- Some outposts in the older games really are empty, to allow us to go back and have fun, why not?
- /signed ...
gene terrodon
No, not this again...
I thought the horse was dead.
I thought the horse was dead.
crazy diamond
Quote:
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Originally Posted by gene terrodon
No, not this again...
I thought the horse was dead. |
Zeek Aran
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bryant Again
Stop bumping this thread.
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Creeping Carl
I'd like 7 heroes too. And if you don't like me bumping this thread, then tough cookies.
Rhedd
Someday, I'm sure, I'll be enlightened enough to understand why some players need to dictate how other players enjoy a game, even though it doesn't effect them in the slightest.
On that day, I'm sure my body will burst into golden light, and I'll ascend directly to the heavens.
Until then, though, I'll have to content myself with reading things like this and saying, "WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU PEOPLE, ANYWAY?"
Oh, and seven heroes wouldn't hurt a thing.
On that day, I'm sure my body will burst into golden light, and I'll ascend directly to the heavens.
Until then, though, I'll have to content myself with reading things like this and saying, "WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU PEOPLE, ANYWAY?"
Oh, and seven heroes wouldn't hurt a thing.
N E D M
I thought we already had a 7 heroes thread
in sardelaac
where it belongs
instead of here
...
in sardelaac
where it belongs
instead of here
...
Zeek Aran
Quote:
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Originally Posted by N E D M
I thought we already had a 7 heroes thread
in sardelaac where it belongs instead of here ... |
Makkert
Would you like to have fries with that?
Rhedd
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Zeek Aran
Quote:
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Zeek Aran
I'm pretty sure we do. Just stop bumping it. >>;
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=HT=Ingram
lol I was very excited originally to have heroes cause I thought they would be account based... only having to equip them 1 time for your account and they became your companions through your adventuring. However now that I have equipt 300 heroes with runes, inscriptions, weapons, and so forth; OUCH, I can say that it was nothing but a total Pain in the assets how Anet implemented them.
However I would not want to micro manage 7 heroes, nor do I think others would. And since only a FEW heroes AI is very good, and only on specific things... I know I would have to...
Rangers are only good if they have a short bow and are interrupting.
Necros only good if making minions. SS, Curses builds are piss poor unless you micromanage.
Monks are ok at heals, but really bad at Prot, and forget about enchantments or bonds... And using them to smite is a joke.
Warriors AI just plain sucks. Indeed I personally feel the class is a joke. but thats just me...
Assassins AI is laughable in heroes... I know of no one that uses them at all...
mesmers are good ONLY if you micromanage, especially if echos are involved.
Rits are only really good at Spirt spamming. though they Often Kill their spirts when its not time, and never move them or otherwise make good use of them.
Eles are just about the only class you can use that can take care of itself no matter what attrib is being used however they tend to get targeted quickly.
The Paragon is really good at command, but piss poor at leadership in a way thats understanding. Spear is pretty good on AI too...
Dervish is a good tank AI. and seems to take care of itself well... I guess those were the ultimate AI end product that had the most attention.
It would be different if your AI for your Heroes Learned a little... Like if your micromanaging the build over time it learns what you want it to do and updates its AI to match your management. But that never seemed to happen...
I'm sorry but I personally think if Anet ever makes it 7 hero based, the game might as well just go full single player and offline and be done with it... Its almost that with 3 heroes. Going to a full 7 just assures the demise of GW 1 as a multiplayer game.
However I would not want to micro manage 7 heroes, nor do I think others would. And since only a FEW heroes AI is very good, and only on specific things... I know I would have to...
Rangers are only good if they have a short bow and are interrupting.
Necros only good if making minions. SS, Curses builds are piss poor unless you micromanage.
Monks are ok at heals, but really bad at Prot, and forget about enchantments or bonds... And using them to smite is a joke.
Warriors AI just plain sucks. Indeed I personally feel the class is a joke. but thats just me...
Assassins AI is laughable in heroes... I know of no one that uses them at all...
mesmers are good ONLY if you micromanage, especially if echos are involved.
Rits are only really good at Spirt spamming. though they Often Kill their spirts when its not time, and never move them or otherwise make good use of them.
Eles are just about the only class you can use that can take care of itself no matter what attrib is being used however they tend to get targeted quickly.
The Paragon is really good at command, but piss poor at leadership in a way thats understanding. Spear is pretty good on AI too...
Dervish is a good tank AI. and seems to take care of itself well... I guess those were the ultimate AI end product that had the most attention.
It would be different if your AI for your Heroes Learned a little... Like if your micromanaging the build over time it learns what you want it to do and updates its AI to match your management. But that never seemed to happen...
I'm sorry but I personally think if Anet ever makes it 7 hero based, the game might as well just go full single player and offline and be done with it... Its almost that with 3 heroes. Going to a full 7 just assures the demise of GW 1 as a multiplayer game.
Isileth
=HT=Ingram, GW is advertised as a game you can play solo with AI if you choose.
Those people who want to PuG still can, it wouldnt stop anyone from chosing to PuG if they prefer to play that way.
And as for people not wanting to manage 7 heroes, they dont have to.
Those people who would like to play with 7 heroes could.
Those people who would like to play with 5 heroes could.
Those people who would like to play with 3 heroes could.
Those people who would like to play with 7 players could.
All this would change is that people who want to use up to 7 heroes can.
Those people who want to PuG still can, it wouldnt stop anyone from chosing to PuG if they prefer to play that way.
And as for people not wanting to manage 7 heroes, they dont have to.
Those people who would like to play with 7 heroes could.
Those people who would like to play with 5 heroes could.
Those people who would like to play with 3 heroes could.
Those people who would like to play with 7 players could.
All this would change is that people who want to use up to 7 heroes can.
=HT=Ingram
Oh I agree the choice is there, but lets face it. the ONLY reason anyone pugs anymore is cause there is a small limitation on heroes. So people pug up 2 at a time and go with 6 heroes. ok great... That maintains at least the possibility that the community will still play together, and not just exploit each other for ill gotten profit. But when they make it that its all solo based and actually EASIER cause you can control it all. SOMEHOW... Well why would anyone have a reason to go in PUGS anymore? At that point just make the game single player offline and be done with it is all I'm saying. That may well be where GW1 ends up someday. I mean I like my friends, and I like to play with them, but sometimes they just piss me off and I have to go do something on my own. So its not like I don't understand the desire. but I am being honest here. If I could just have nothing but all heroes with all the buffs in the world on every one of them, and all the best weapons on them possible. Eventually I would have no reason to ever interact with another player in the game ever again.
IF. and this is a BIG IF... GW2 is a success and gets the majority of the community active in it instead of GW1. So All GW servers go offline and GW1 client becomes an offline single player game with 7 heroes. That is the likely future of GW within say 3 more years, IF GW2 takes over and no more content is ever added to GW1. Just my opinion...
IF. and this is a BIG IF... GW2 is a success and gets the majority of the community active in it instead of GW1. So All GW servers go offline and GW1 client becomes an offline single player game with 7 heroes. That is the likely future of GW within say 3 more years, IF GW2 takes over and no more content is ever added to GW1. Just my opinion...
arcanemacabre
Quote:
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Originally Posted by =HT=Ingram
Oh I agree the choice is there, but lets face it. the ONLY reason anyone pugs anymore is cause there is a small limitation on heroes.
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EDIT: To add to this, in a perfect social world, no one would PuG because everyone would be in a nice, full, helpful guild that always play together. Either way, those who you would want to PuG with aren't going to be the same breed as those who would rather have 7 heroes. People want 7 heroes either because they don't want to PuG, or they demand efficiency on their level, and would be a 'nazi' when it came to teamwork and builds. I doubt you'd want either person on your team.
Isileth
Quote:
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Originally Posted by =HT=Ingram
Well why would anyone have a reason to go in PUGS anymore?
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Oh and saying the reason people pug is because of the limitation on heroes is wrong.
I went h/h when Nightfall was out.
I went all henchies in the previous games.
Its the same for a lot of people (If you read through some of the other 7 hero threads you will see others saying this). If at any point I was forced into pugging I would have just stopped playing.
I wouldnt have switched to PuGs, I joined the game because I could take AI and go do my own thing.
People who enjoy pugging, who play with friend/guild teams will continue to do so.
BlackSephir
Quote:
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Originally Posted by =HT=Ingram
Oh I agree the choice is there, but lets face it. the ONLY reason anyone pugs anymore is cause there is a small limitation on heroes.
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Faer
Quote:
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Originally Posted by N E D M
I thought we already had a 7 heroes thread
in sardelaac where it belongs instead of here ... |