My paragon's buddies
Antithesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by Problem.
...since you dont need dark fury, it would be possible to run Order of the Vampire instead of Order of Pain, and then you have a free slot where dark fury was. OoV may make up for some of the party healing lost from the D/N
also personally, i tend to stick with the n/rt cause i like to splinter rape pve. Exactly what i had in mind too. OotV + DF = no-no. Without DF, OotV becomes viable.
also personally, i tend to stick with the n/rt cause i like to splinter rape pve. Exactly what i had in mind too. OotV + DF = no-no. Without DF, OotV becomes viable.
doragon
Too bad can't use this a ritualist :/
Shru where's the builds for other professions??
EDIT: so what have you been thinking for a rit? some tactics buffs? channeling splinter weapon, what else? :P
Shru where's the builds for other professions??
EDIT: so what have you been thinking for a rit? some tactics buffs? channeling splinter weapon, what else? :P
Sethellington
a rit is easier to come up with than nec i think. try something like
[save yourselves!][weapon of aggression][spirit's strength][for great justice!]
maybe throw in [vocal was sogolon] to use before [for great justice!] and then drop it and build adrenaline.
[save yourselves!][weapon of aggression][spirit's strength][for great justice!]
maybe throw in [vocal was sogolon] to use before [for great justice!] and then drop it and build adrenaline.
Racthoh
Order of the Vampire is definately an interesting option, although the problem I have is finding necromancer skills to run once I spec into blood. The two orders and Dark Fury are basically the only really useful skills in the line. 
Problem.
I tried the Life Barrier bar in Gates of Madness, and it failed miserably because of enchant removal. So i'm not quite sure what other options to use in terms of damage reduction.
shru
Ranger:[build name="SY Ranger" prof=R/W marksmanship=12 expertise=12][distracting shot][save yourselves][triple shot][dual shot][rapid fire][ebon battle standard of honor][infuriating heat][resurrection signet][/build]
Assassin:[build name="SY Sin" prof=A/W criticalstrikes=12+1 daggermastery=12+1+1][Golden Phoenix Strike][death blossom][Moebius Strike][Save yourselves][critical agility][critical defense][critical eye][for great justice][/build]
with the attack speed of this guy, you're safe to drop [for great justice]and[golden phoenix strike] in favor of a better lead combo, something like [golden lotus strike]+[golden fang strike] or [golden fox strike]+[golden fang strike]
Dervish:[build name="SY Derv" prof=D/W Mysticism=12+1 ScytheMastery=12+1+1][protector's strike][eremite's attack][save yourselves][aura of holy might][heart of fury][for great justice][avatar of lyssa][eternal aura][/build]or mel derv[build name="SY Derv" prof=D/W Mysticism=12+1 ScytheMastery=12+1+1][wearying strike][save yourselves][aura of holy might][heart of fury][zealous renewal][for great justice][avatar of melandru][eternal aura][/build]
Warrior:[build name="SY War" prof=W/P Swordsmanship=12+1+1 Strength=12+1][Dragon Slash][brawling headbutt][steelfang slash][Save yourselves][flail][enraging charge][enduring harmony][for great justice][/build]
Necro:[SY Nec;OAFCQsxkKEU1NYngoHWxVBGH](thanks go to Moloch Vein for the build)
Ritualist:
And currently playing with the rit builds, I don't have a rit to test energy costs and such
so no actual builds yet.
for Spirit's strength I've been toying with sword and axe builds using some of these:
[brawling headbutt] [steelfang slash] [whirlwind attack] [cyclone axe][dismember] [spirit's strength] [sight beyond sight] [save yourselves] [for great justice] [weapon of aggression] [great dwarf armor]
and a channeling caster similair in play style to the N/W
[weapon of fury] [save yourselves] [spirit rift] [splinter weapon] [ancestor's rage] [for great justice] [flurry] [warmonger's weapon]
I know some of these builds aren't optimal (help with mel derv and rits please?) but these are all just suggestions and examples. Post anything you think should be changed on them, and I'll update them as I see new and more powerful ones emerging.
Assassin:[build name="SY Sin" prof=A/W criticalstrikes=12+1 daggermastery=12+1+1][Golden Phoenix Strike][death blossom][Moebius Strike][Save yourselves][critical agility][critical defense][critical eye][for great justice][/build]
with the attack speed of this guy, you're safe to drop [for great justice]and[golden phoenix strike] in favor of a better lead combo, something like [golden lotus strike]+[golden fang strike] or [golden fox strike]+[golden fang strike]
Dervish:[build name="SY Derv" prof=D/W Mysticism=12+1 ScytheMastery=12+1+1][protector's strike][eremite's attack][save yourselves][aura of holy might][heart of fury][for great justice][avatar of lyssa][eternal aura][/build]or mel derv[build name="SY Derv" prof=D/W Mysticism=12+1 ScytheMastery=12+1+1][wearying strike][save yourselves][aura of holy might][heart of fury][zealous renewal][for great justice][avatar of melandru][eternal aura][/build]
Warrior:[build name="SY War" prof=W/P Swordsmanship=12+1+1 Strength=12+1][Dragon Slash][brawling headbutt][steelfang slash][Save yourselves][flail][enraging charge][enduring harmony][for great justice][/build]
Necro:[SY Nec;OAFCQsxkKEU1NYngoHWxVBGH](thanks go to Moloch Vein for the build)
Ritualist:
And currently playing with the rit builds, I don't have a rit to test energy costs and such
so no actual builds yet.for Spirit's strength I've been toying with sword and axe builds using some of these:
[brawling headbutt] [steelfang slash] [whirlwind attack] [cyclone axe][dismember] [spirit's strength] [sight beyond sight] [save yourselves] [for great justice] [weapon of aggression] [great dwarf armor]
and a channeling caster similair in play style to the N/W
[weapon of fury] [save yourselves] [spirit rift] [splinter weapon] [ancestor's rage] [for great justice] [flurry] [warmonger's weapon]
I know some of these builds aren't optimal (help with mel derv and rits please?) but these are all just suggestions and examples. Post anything you think should be changed on them, and I'll update them as I see new and more powerful ones emerging.
War My Guild
[Spirit's Strength] [Vital Weapon] [Great Dwarf Armor] [Ebon Battle Standard of Honor] [Save Yourselves] [For Great Justice]
Umm... Yeah, that's pretty much my plan.
Also, I don't see [Sight Beyond Sight] as a good PvE choice. Seriously, I don't think Blind is used much in PvE, sure it can be added for those tough areas, but that's about it.
Here's an idea... Rt/W
[Dragon Slash] [Weapon of Aggression] [Great Dwarf Armor] [Ebon Battle Standard of Honor] [Save Yourselves] [For Great Justice]
Plus 2 Swordsmanship or Channelling skills.
Or even:
[Spirit's Strength] [Weapon of Aggression] [Cyclone Axe] [Great Dwarf Armor] [Ebon Battle Standard of Honor] [Save Yourselves] [For Great Justice]'
Realistically, no attribute points would even need to go into Axe Mastery, as it would be mainly used to gain adrenline.
Umm... Yeah, that's pretty much my plan.
Also, I don't see [Sight Beyond Sight] as a good PvE choice. Seriously, I don't think Blind is used much in PvE, sure it can be added for those tough areas, but that's about it.
Here's an idea... Rt/W
[Dragon Slash] [Weapon of Aggression] [Great Dwarf Armor] [Ebon Battle Standard of Honor] [Save Yourselves] [For Great Justice]
Plus 2 Swordsmanship or Channelling skills.
Or even:
[Spirit's Strength] [Weapon of Aggression] [Cyclone Axe] [Great Dwarf Armor] [Ebon Battle Standard of Honor] [Save Yourselves] [For Great Justice]'
Realistically, no attribute points would even need to go into Axe Mastery, as it would be mainly used to gain adrenline.
shru
Quote:
Originally Posted by War My Guild
Quote:
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Originally Posted by War My Guild
Realistically, no attribute points would even need to go into Axe Mastery, as it would be mainly used to gain adrenline.
While that may be true, I'm focusing on builds that optimize offense/support while still being able to maintain SY at an acceptable rate. Anyone can throw together an 8 skill bar bent on perma SY, but how useful is it realy when you can do the same thing with a highly offensive character?
All these templates are focusing on maximizing damage without sacrificing the SY aspect, the real challenge is balancing the damage vs. % SY is up, which I think most do fairly well. Not specing into axe may provide you with a means to spam SY, but how is it going to help you in that offensive mindset? War My Guild
I see your way of thinking. I've never ever tried a War or Paragon, so I really have no idea how fast one gets adrenline. I assumed that the main point of these builds was to spam SY! and then try to do additional damage.
I've come up with a new idea(lol). Assuming [Steady Stance] applies to knockdowns done by [Desperation Blow] and/or [Drunken Blow], then a build like this may really do well, with any profession primary: [Steady Stance] [Drunken Blow] [Save Yourselves] [Shields Up] [To the Limit] [For Great Justice] [Great Dwarf Armor] [Ebon Battle Standard of Honor] Any/W... Would it work? Obviously, [Ebon Battle Standard of Honor] and [Great Dwarf Armor] could be swapped out for any other PvE or more a more profession specific skill. [Shields up] can be replaced with [Watch Yourself]. Tactics: 12 And the rest is open... More Damage output, but less party wide support: [Steady Stance] [Drunken Blow] [Save Yourselves] [Desperation Blow] [To the Limit] [Dismember] [Great Dwarf Armor] [you move like a dwarf] Edit: Found out Steady Stance does benefit from Drunken Blow and Desperation Blow.
Antithesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by War My Guild
[Steady Stance] [Drunken Blow] [Save Yourselves] [Shields Up] [To the Limit] [For Great Justice] [Great Dwarf Armor] [Ebon Battle Standard of Honor]
Too heavy on the energy, Steady+DB is ok but not great in PvE, the build is better as a W/D.
Stick with the basics of God-mode D-Slasher Shru posted. The only Strength skills are Flail and Enraging Charge, neither are needed for a X/W. Obviously Enduring Harmony won't fit without a /P, but the adrenal engine is pretty covered by D-Slash, Brawling HB and Steelfang during the downtime of FGJ. A DB/Moebius Sin shouldn't have too many problems building adrenaline without resorting to a pseudo-Warrior bar, nor should a Derv, Ranger or Paragon. Casters are more challenging and it's fun to devise a build, but really, why would you use Racway or go /W with a caster? The SY spammer is the linchpin of Racway's defense, SY is gonna make a squishy player even squishier. GDW will help, but you'll still be a hot target for agro. Personally, i'd only go Racway with a physicals, stick to Sabway with casters. TheDolph
[build prof=N/Rt bloodmagic="12+1" deathmagic="10+1+1" soulreaping="8"][Dark Fury][Order of Pain][Animate Bone Fiend][Blood of the Master][Signet of Lost Souls][Aura of the Lich][Blood Ritual][Death Pact Signet][/build]
Okey, lets see if this gwBB thing works for me... I was thinking that you could replace the D/N with a Necro that was mixed MM and orders. It could still pump out Dark Fury and Order of Pain, and further help with the offence with 8 ranged minions that would benefit from the Ebon Battle Standard. I know it is alot of sacrificing, hence I put aura of the lich in there to lessen the amount of healing needed. I don't know how the minions would stay inside the Battle Standard or even if one can put 12/10/8, but I though this might work in areas where 2 monk henchies would be enough. Thoughts?
Mr Pink57
I swapped [Empathic Removal] for [Signet of Removal] on the hex heavy setups and found a good outcome since OoP and DF are up pretty much all the time they use the same as [Empathic Removal] but for free.
pink
Antithesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDolph
[build prof=N/Rt bloodmagic="12+1" deathmagic="10+1+1" soulreaping="8"][Dark Fury][Order of Pain][Animate Bone Fiend][Blood of the Master][Signet of Lost Souls][Aura of the Lich][Blood Ritual][Death Pact Signet][/build]
....Thoughts? 4 sac skills? Looks like a corpsemaker. doragon
I did some small testing with ritualist. Weapon of fury is better for gaining adrealine than weapon of aggression against single targets.
Then i made some test against master of damage. i used the following build: [skill]Weapon of fury[/skill],[skill]cyclone axe[/skill],[skill]dismember[/skill],[skill]whirlwind attack[/skill],[skill]save yourselves[/skill]. 12 axe mastery, 14 channeling. I was attacking master and both adjacent practise targets. I was able to use save yourselves after each attack chain, 4 times in 20sec. Total damage in 20sec =~400 avarage 20dmg per second. Then i did the same test with [skill]Spirit's strength[/skill],[skill]weapon of aggression[/skill],[skill]save yourselves[/skill],[skill]cyclone axe[/skill],[skill]dismember[/skill],[skill]whirlwind attack[/skill]. 10 axe mastery, 12 channeling, 11 spawning. Again i was attacking both the practise targets and the master. I wasn't able to use save your selves as often as with weapon of fury, but i did more damage, ~800dmg in 20sec avarega dmg ~32. With "for great justice" i was able to use "save your selves" as often as in the first build. I liked the build with "Weapon of fury" more cause with it you didn't need to stop casting "weapon of aggression" every 13sec. "Weapon of Fury" lasted 19sec. almost same recharge as ebon battle standard of honor(20sec)/ great dwarf armor (40sec), you could stop to cast both at the same time, if you took it to your build. In "weapon of fury" build there is 2 open slots, maybe take some channeling skills ([skill]ancestor's rage[/skill] or [skill]splinter weapon[/skill]) or more axe skills ([skill]furious axe[/skill]" or anything that uses energy, cause energy ain't a problem.) Then little about armor, 60armor + shield 8armor + Ghost forge insignas 15armor + great dwarf armor 24armor = 107armor. ain't that enough? TheDolph
Quote:
Originally Posted by Antithesis
4 sac skills? Looks like a corpsemaker.
Well aura of the lich made zingeri's dual mm's work. And thats a constant 45% saccing from Blood of the master. Maybe if youput sup blood and maybe even death you could carry the necro's health down to 300 or so, and with aura of the lich it becomes around 150, saccing from that should easily be healed up with minor heals, and BR is kind of optional, didn't come up with anything else to put there, maybe another quick recharge self heal, maybe vampiric gaze or something?
doragon
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Pink57
I swapped [Empathic Removal] for [Signet of Removal] on the hex heavy setups and found a good outcome since OoP and DF are up pretty much all the time they use the same as [Empathic Removal] but for free.
pink there's one differense in those skill empathic removal also removes hex and condition from you. That's quite good in hevy hex areas. Edit: didn't want to do new post Then little about the ritualist build. I used [skill]weapon of fury[/skill],[skill]save yourselves[/skill],[skill]cyclone axe[/skill],[skill]whirlwind attack[/skill],[skill]dismember[/skill],[skill]ancestor's rage[/skill],[skill]great dwarf armor[/skill],[skill]Flesh of my flesh[/skill] I vanguished an area quite easily. It worked pretty well, most of the time i wasn't the target and i could keep save yourselves upp quite good.
Fuzzy Taco
Quote:
Originally Posted by shru
[Necro SY! bot;OAFCY8xE/SZglAAgo3NIWRuI] the last slot is yours to play with - you don't really need Necrosis, either. you can pack a fish hex like Shadow of Fear for areas with hex removal, and you can slot Rigor Mortis for areas with block.
Racthoh
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Pink57
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by TheDolph
health down to 300
Enemy AI generally targets whatever has the lowest health. I would not put my adrenaline and damage engine on something that is going to become the focus of enemy fire.
Richardt
Quote:
Originally Posted by Racthoh
Order of the Vampire is definately an interesting option, although the problem I have is finding necromancer skills to run once I spec into blood. The two orders and Dark Fury are basically the only really useful skills in the line.
I've actually been having luck with a OotV/Mark of Fury restorer (this was based off a suggestion in another thread by Antithesis). Basically I swapped the Elite for Order of the Vampire, Rez for Mark Of Fury and Vengeful Weapon for Ghostmirrior Light (I think that's the name-it's the one that heals the target and caster at the same time). There's one more change I believe I made, but I'll have to post it later as I'm at work. You don't get as much andrenaline from Mark of Fury as you do Dark Fury, but it works decently. I've used it in a variety of places (both NM and HM) and performs pretty good.
Racthoh
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richardt
You don't get as much andrenaline from Mark of Fury as you do Dark Fury, but it works decently. I've used it in a variety of places (both NM and HM) and performs pretty good.
10 seconds is an eternity. I could see it being useful if I were to call an off target for my heroes to attack while I micro a Mark of Fury onto what I'm attacking, but then my other physicals aren't getting the adrenaline boost.
Richardt
Mark Of Fury I usually micro on like monks and stuff to get Stunning Strike powered up. Other then that, my Livia just casts it on whoever is handy (normally though whoever I'm targeting).
The big drawback though (besides just being on a single target) is it's recharge-normally she's only able to get it off once and then the mobs down-if the mob is large or features more than one healer, she might get it off once or twice more.
FyrFytr998
If this has already been discussed, forgive me. I don't feel like reviewing all the pages.
So I went and grinded away to get SY for my Warrior. And while the SY Warrior build is awesome for adrenal gain. I noticed that my party members were hardly ever within my aggro bubble. Which is supposedly the effective "earshot" range for SY. Are there any players here that could explain how best to utilize SY on a mobile character? It seems this build is better suited for the ranged attackers. Covah
Quote:
Originally Posted by FyrFytr998
. I noticed that my party members were hardly ever within my aggro bubble.
Stop overextending? Monks should always been on the edge of your aggro bubble healing you and all the other casters should be in your aggro.
Richardt
You have three options:
1) Move to cover them-this is easier on a ranged character I'll admit 2) Explain how SY! works. Chances are they'll be hiding in your aggro once you tell them you're doing 80% damage reduction. 3) If number 2 doesn't work, tell them that if they're out of your aggro bubble, you can't protect them. Guarentee after a couple deaths they'll learn. And yes, I do option 3 on almost a regular basis-oddly enough right after I do option 2. But when they start accumalating that DP they normally smarten up.
FyrFytr998
Quote:
Originally Posted by Covah
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Originally Posted by Richardt
You have three options:
1) Move to cover them-this is easier on a ranged character I'll admit 2) Explain how SY! works. Chances are they'll be hiding in your aggro once you tell them you're doing 80% damage reduction. 3) If number 2 doesn't work, tell them that if they're out of your aggro bubble, you can't protect them. Guarentee after a couple deaths they'll learn. And yes, I do option 3 on almost a regular basis-oddly enough right after I do option 2. But when they start accumalating that DP they normally smarten up. Lol, maybe I should have explained MYSELF, better. I strictly Hero/Hench. My problem is that they pretty much run pell mell all over the place. While my movement is only really going from target to target. Should I plant a flag, and pull aggro to myself while maintaining my party within my bubble? I've always been a big fan of my party out of my bubble to give them some breathing room. Again, it just seems to me that this is a set up best used with Paragons and Rangers.
Antithesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by FyrFytr998
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by FyrFytr998
Again, it just seems to me that this is a set up best used with Paragons and Rangers.
Racway works fine for all Physical classes, in this order IMO - Paragon > Warrior > Ranger > Dervish > Assassin. As long as you can build Adrenaline relatively easily, you can run Racway.
FyrFytr998
Quote:
Originally Posted by Antithesis
If they're out of your bubble they're safe, but they're also out of range to attack. There's no need to flag H/H unless pulling mobs from a large group or moving them out of AoE or environmental effects.
Racway works fine for all Physical classes, in this order IMO - Paragon > Warrior > Ranger > Dervish > Assassin. As long as you can build Adrenaline relatively easily, you can run Racway. Bear with me. Maybe I'm just being over analytical. I see and understand what you said, but if my H/H group is spread around and not really in the bubble so to speak. Doesn't that make SY pretty inefficient to a Warrior or Melee class toon? As I am moving around making it likely my bubble is all over the place as well. Whereas Racway with a Para or Ranger is a sort of circle the wagons and protect the squishys with very little movement other than getting into range of the weapon? I'm really just wondering how I can as a warrior make sure the majority of my party is benefitting from SY spam.
Richardt
Ah-H/H makes more sense now
 What I normally do (did this on my warrior and para) is to flag the non-squishy's in front, and then flag the squishy's in the back just barely in aggro range. They'll still get the SY! but they should be out of range of the nastier guys.
Racthoh
When I play warrior H/H I'll generally call the target I want to die for the heroes to beat on while I attack something closer. Sucks to waste the damage but at least we get to live.
Richardt
[build prof=n/rt box name="OotV Restorer" blood=10+1+2 soulreaping=8+1 restoration=12][order of the vampire][mark of fury][signet of lost souls][ghostmirror light][spirit light][mend body and soul][life][soothing memories][/build]
For those that are curious, this is the build I was talking about earlier. It's basically the N/Rt Restorer set up to buff physicals. I just throw on Radiants and use Vanahk's Staff-if you need a bit more energy, you could use a major SR rune, but mines been doing great with just a 9 SR. I actually like this better then the D/N orders (although Mark of Fury isn't as good as Dark Fury )It's not overly original, but it gets the job done. doragon
Tested a new ritualist build this morning and it definitely beats the builds with Spirit's strenght and weapon of fury.
So here's the build: [skill]dragon slash[/skill],[skill]brawling headbutt[/skill],[skill]steelfang slash[/skill],[skill]save yourselves[/skill],[skill]resilient weapon[/skill],[skill]for great justice[/skill],[skill]vocal was sogolon[/skill],[skill]great dwarf armor[/skill] 12 swordmanship 12+2 restoration 3 spawning equipment: Caster modded sword armor with blessed/ghost forge/survivor insignas The fifth slot is optimal, it can be any resto skill. A spirit which you put before fight, a weapon or a res. War My Guild
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richardt
[build prof=n/rt box name="OotV Restorer" blood=10+1+2 soulreaping=8+1 restoration=12][order of the vampire][mark of fury][signet of lost souls][ghostmirror light][spirit light][mend body and soul][life][soothing memories][/build]
For those that are curious, this is the build I was talking about earlier. It's basically the N/Rt Restorer set up to buff physicals. I just throw on Radiants and use Vanahk's Staff-if you need a bit more energy, you could use a major SR rune, but mines been doing great with just a 9 SR. I actually like this better then the D/N orders (although Mark of Fury isn't as good as Dark Fury )It's not overly original, but it gets the job done. Using OotV gives health benefits from attacks, but it does nothing for adrenaline, which is what these builds are built on pretty much. Especially if you're a Rt or N primary, I'd expect that a Dark Fury build would be more effective because caster classes have problems with gaining adrenaline.
Richardt
Totally agree with you there-Mark of Fury works, but it's a single target sort of thing. So my alternative to the D/N orders really benefits more ranged SY users (or those with a high Kurz/Lux title or a prof. with a great IAS).
As for the two paragon heroes, they do just fine without Dark Fury-sure DF helps, but it isn't necessary.
Sethellington Difficulty: Master Yeah right, whatever. I did it first with 2 para heroes but found it to work much better if i had a minion bomber, and modded the para build slightly. Threw in Air of Superiority to recharge "FGJ!" Swords: 12 Tactics: 10 Soul Reaping 8+1+1 With "FGJ!" up, and my target not kiting I could keep up SY! with R1 Luxon without any problems. Yes, really. Also spamming DSlash meant I was doing a pretty good DPS. (On master of damage around 40-60 DPS depending on whether SY!/FGJ! where up.) Hope that helps Any/W wanting to play SY! spammer  EDIT: I also took the wrong Ranger hero !! I wanted Zho xD doragon
What about changing the D/N orders to N/Mo prot+orders? It could help a lot if the player is a caster. Maybe bonding?
darcness boy
[build prof=Mo/W box name="SY monk" smit=12+1+3 Swo=12][Hundred Blades][Sun and Moon Slash][Whirlwind Attack][flurry]["Save Yourselves!"]["for Great Justice!"][Strength of Honor][Rebirth][/build]
Tried to do SY build for monk :P
- Tain -
Drop rebirth and add more utility. The chances of you being the last one standing as a super-squishy frontliner are... well, not going to happen.
Bassu
Ummm sorry Sethe, but isn't that NM? You could shout SY indefinitely, so? Air of Superiority is indeed a good idea though!
doragon
The only problem with air of superiority is that it uses the last pve slot. (max 3 pve skills), i'd take something more defensive, cause you'll have the lowest armor and everyone is attacking you. At least being target in HM is the biggest problem.
Richardt
I like the strength and honor idea (/steals
 ), but instead of hundred blades, I would use DSlash.
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